October 25, 2013

Mossad v. the president of France

The French government has complained for decades that the "Anglo-Saxon powers" have been electronically spying on the rest of the world, with roots going back to the now-famous Enigma Project during WWII. 

But a new report in Le Monde suggests that the U.S. implied to France that Israel -- not the U.S., Britain, Canada, Australia, or New Zealand (the "Five Eyes") -- carried out the 2012 cyber attack to bug then-President Sarkozy's telephone. 

Not surprisingly, the Daily Mail has the most fun interpretation of the Le Monde revelation.
Was ISRAEL behind the hacking of millions of French phones and NOT the U.S.? 
Extraordinary twist in spying saga revealed 
Agents said to have intercepted 70 million calls and text messages a month 
France had previously blamed the United States of America 
U.S. was first suspected of hacking into Nicolas Sarkozy's phone in 2012 
Americans insisted they have never been behind hacking in France 
Comes after it emerged German officials are planning trip to U.S. to discuss allegations Angela Merkel's phone was hack by the NSA 
The German Chancellor said President Obama's reputation has been shattered on an international scale because of espionage scandal

The Israeli press, Haaretzs and the Jerusalem Post, has been more restrained, focusing mostly on the cyber-attack on the President of France, rather than on 70 million messages a month.

As I pointed out in June, Glenn Greenwald and Edward Snowden were clever to avoid the mistake of bringing up Israeli snooping too early in the discussion of the NSA, since the I-word triggers the crimestop reflex in well-trained adults. 

It's incredible how effective at shutting down inquiries are the questions: "Why are you asking? Why do you want to know?"

My answer is always: Because knowledge is better than ignorance.

But increasing numbers of people can easily be browbeaten into feeling guilty about wishing to become less ignorant.

27 comments:

Sam said...

The Israeli's snooping is for blackmail. The cheapest method to control those in power and enforce the mental control of the #Neo-Synagogue.

Whiskey said...

Steve it is the abuse domestically by Obama that is the big story, followed by the backdoors int Windows and OSX, rest assured every hacker is looking now that they have confirmation. Next is US helping US companies spy on foriegn rivals.

Did Israel spy on France? I would say yes, also Russia, Iran, Saudi, Italy, Syria, and Egypt at a min and guaranteed China. The latter a direct competitor in building, operating nuke power plants. Add South Korea too.

It is so easy every nation even remotely interested does it. And will do it. For national champion commercial reasons if nothing else.

Then there is the anti terror aspect, France is loaded with jihadis, and the exile issue, France is loaded with Iranian and Kurd and Egyptian and Syrian exiles, collectively the target of at least a dozen nations. Essier to get everything. Tap everyones phone.

Nook spelling sucks sorry.

Whiskey said...

Oh I'm sure at least a dozen countries vacuum up French and Euro data. But Obama is the only one caught. Israel and Jews are as popular in lefty, Muslim France as they were in Vichy or the Ayatollahs regime. If the French really believed this they'd push to have EU to block trade which most members hard hard left and Muslim dominated want anyway. Good for Hollande to get out of Gypsy mess.

So that's how you tell. What Hollande does. More Obama bs. Israel is rarely caught, when that happens their people get killed.

Auntie Analogue said...


This is a rather naïve kerfuffle, as nations, even allied nations, have always spied on and attempted to manipulate one another.

Even during the Second World War the Americans and the British schemed and caviled against each other to get their way in Allied strategy and policy, even to gain knowledge of the workings within each other's high councils (not to mention the lengths to which Stalin went against all of the Western allies).

Penny Al Arrabbiata said...

OT, but get how quickly a story of Gypsy child trafficking - which turned out to be true - has rapidly morphed into "those poor, oppressed Gypsies."

Better we bar police from using common sense and let millions of victims suffer the consequences than let a few brown people briefly have their feelings hurt.

Anonymous said...

OT, but here's a picture of the "Not in My Backyard, In Yours" Chapter of the National Association for the Advancement of Billionaire People (aka, Partnership for a New American Economy). From left to right:

1. Bill Marriott, Jr. Net Worth: $2 billion.

2. Bob Iger. 2007-11 total pay: $157 million.

3. Jim McNerney (Boeing). 2012 pay: $21.1 million

4. "Mayor" Julian Castro, token Hispanic dude.

5. Michael Bloomberg. Net Worth: $31 billion.

6. Mayor Michael Nutter, token black dude.

7. Rupert Murdoch. Net Worth: $13.4 billion.

8. Steve Ballmer. Net Worth: $18 billion.

This coming week, these poor struggling Americans are gunna fly in on their BBJ's and tell Congress how much their suffering because they don't have serfs to man their sweatshops.

Anonymous said...

Ho hum. The goyim are pissing their panties in terror of us again. Cute little kindergarden children. Hey'd ya see the new brunette employee at my favorite felafel joint in south T-A? Fresh out of the army, legs up to here, tits as perky as only a 22-year olds can be. Life goes on. Ho hum.

Anonymous said...

Life goes on. Ho hum.

Yeah, you're absolutely right. Ignorance is better than knowledge, or so they say.

Big Bill said...

Hey'd ya see the new brunette employee at my favorite felafel joint in south T-A? Fresh out of the army, legs up to here, tits as perky as only a 22-year olds can be.

Hmm. Maybe I did. Was she one of those IDF girls in the soft-core porn shots taken in the IDF barracks? If so I will be glad to take as many of those horny wenches as I can get.

In their photos they looked like they could suck the chrome right of a trailer hitch (or the flash suppressor off an M16!).

One proviso: you have to agree to take some of our JAPs in return. They are pretty mouthy, entitled bunch. You sabra dudes could whip them into shape in a year or less (and they would love you for it!).

We'll stick 'em on a Nefesh b'Nefesh flight and they're yours (only you can't send them back). Deal?

anony-mouse said...

1/ I'm shocked, shocked to find out that spying goes on between countries.

Sun Tzu is 2500.

2/ I'm utterly sure that France would never, never spy on any other country.

As an aside I always thought that the objection to the NSA's activities was that it spied on Americans. The fact that people are now objecting to its spying on foreigners, and especially foreign governments, indicates that Greenwald, et al, aren't just privacy advocates, but simply don't want the US to have a leg up on other governments.

Big Bill said...

Whiskey raises a good point: countries spy on countries and people spy on people. So why get upset if Israel, or AmDocs or the NSA or the Russians or the Chinese hoovers up and indexes every bit of information on the internet? Spying is spying. So what?

Extending Whiskey's logic, why do we even have counter-spy agencies since everyone spies on everyone. We know they are spying. We are spying. Spying is spying. So why care one way or the other what Israel does (or for that matter anyone else)?

Mr. Anon said...

"Anonymous said...

This coming week, these poor struggling Americans are gunna fly in on their BBJ's and tell Congress how much their suffering because they don't have serfs to man their sweatshops."

Funny, I would have thought that "BBJ" stood for "Big Blow Job". And in a way, it kind of does.

Anonymous said...

Um, no, France is one of the antisemitic countries in Europe, and its Jewish population has been the target of increasing attacks from its explosively-growing Muslim population. Does the name 'Ilan Halimi' ring a bell? His torturers actually went out on the street and asked random passersby if they wanted to join in the torture. Several agreed, and not one of those they asked went to the police. Then there was the charming Algerian recently who went around executing Jews on the street at random. The political leadership of France routinely denigrates Jews and their institutions. Witness Sarkozy's comment that "The idea of a country for the Jews is stupid." French academics and opinion-makers openly loathe Jews, even those who are Jewish themselves. France is no friend to the Jews.

Anonymous said...

Ah sucks - what’s a little spying? How about total control of Western democracies?

Why do almost all of our Western politicians support Israel? Does the Mossad have pictures?

Through the US government’s NSA - is Israel now spying on every citizen of every Western country?

Anonymous said...

What a story for an American! One foreign country spies on another foreign country - maybe or maybe not - cause it is just a hint and maybe dis-informaiton. Riveting.

Anonymous said...

This idea that the israel lobby is super powerful and protected by the media might have been true decades ago, but older folks like Steve just can't seem to accept that its no longer the case.

In fact, the true power of the lobby was put to the test with Syria, the first war supported by the lobby that didn't have strong support among politicians. The lobby wasnt able to change a single vote.

Same with hagel, probably the most prominent congressional critic of the israel lobby, who is now Secretary of defense. The campaign to bomb of Iran, which the lobby has been pushing since 2000, never went anywhere.

Not to mention that in this day and age the israel lobby is bashed on every mainstream liberal magazine (the daily beast, salon, the Atlantic etc.). Criticizing the lobby isn't quite the equivalence of saying something racist.

That is to say, andrew Sullivan has plenty more employment opportunities than john derbyshire.

Paul en skis said...

France is no friend to the Jews.

I concur, not as much as the U.S.A. though.

Didn't she look 20?

Moreover, as a persecuted Jew, I can hardly defend myself.

Anonymous said...

"In fact, the true power of the lobby was put to the test with Syria, the first war supported by the lobby that didn't have strong support among politicians. The lobby wasnt able to change a single vote."

That's stupid. If it weren't for the Israeli lobby (and the Saudi lobby), not a single regular person in the US would have even heard of Syria.

The President of the United States went out on a limb for the Israeli lobby saying that we needed to bomb Syria and that we're going to funnel arms to the rebels. The President himself!

You Israeli-sympathizers may not have gotten a full-blown war and regime change out of it, but you got far more than would have happened without your influence.

Anonymous said...

>> If it weren't for the Israeli lobby (and the Saudi lobby), not a single regular person in the US would have even heard of Syria.

The President of the United States went out on a limb for the Israeli lobby saying that we needed to bomb Syria and that we're going to funnel arms to the rebels. The President himself!


you are delusional as a fat frumpy 47 year old feminist-activist who thinks she can be picky about which guy she dates.

The Assad family has preserved the Golan-Heights armistice line as our quietest front. Close to ZERO infiltrations from Syria these past 40-something years. More peaceful than any average county in lily-white Idaho.

No one here wants to get rid of Assad.

Duke of Qin said...

"Israel wanted Assad gone since start of Syria civil war"

http://www.jpost.com/Syria-Crisis/Oren-Jerusalem-has-wanted-Assad-ousted-since-the-outbreak-of-the-Syrian-civil-war-326328

So says the Israeli ambassador.

Boldfaced lying backed up by constant repetition and emotional outrage worked better before anyone could instantly fact check you via the internet.

Anonymous said...

The views of the Israeli ambassador to the U.S. and the Israeli government do not necessarily reflect the views of the Israeli on the street. You exemplify that situation in the U.S. but apparently can't understand that is applies in Israel. Even former holders of high office in Israel occasionally criticize Israeli foreign policy. This article summarizes former Mossad director Meir Dagan's opposition to Netanyahu's push for an Israeli attack against Iran.

Matra said...

The political leadership of France routinely denigrates Jews... French academics and opinion-makers openly loathe Jews

Only a neocon would believe such lies.

Anonymous said...

Boldfaced lying backed up by constant repetition and emotional outrage

The sword cuts both ways. The internet's caught Kevin MacDonald in his Boldfaced lying backed up by constant repetition and emotional outrage.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_B._MacDonald

MacDonald has particularly been accused by other academics of academic fraud, saying that he has promoted anti-Semitic propaganda under the guise of what he says is a legitimate and academic search for truth.[26] He has also been accused of misrepresenting the sources he uses in that regard. Fenris State University professor Dr. Barry Mehler cited for example a quote from a 1969 dissertation by Sheldon Morris Neuringer titled American Jewry and United States immigration policy, 1881-1953 where MacDonald surmised that when Neuringer noted Jewish opposition in 1921 and 1924 to the anti-immigration legislation at the time was due more to it having the “taint of discrimination and anti-Semitism” as opposed to how it would limit Jewish immigration, MacDonald wrote, “…Jewish opposition to the 1921 and 1924 legislation was motivated less by a desire for higher levels of Jewish immigration than by opposition to the implicit theory that America should be dominated by individuals with northern and western European ancestry.” “It seems to me Mr. MacDonald is misrepresenting Mr. Neuringer in this case and I posted my query hoping that a historian familiar with the literature might have a judgment on MacDonald's use of the historical data,” Mehler wrote, citing other examples.[27]

Reviewing MacDonald's Separation and Its Discontents in 2000, Zev Garber writes that MacDonald works from the assumption that the dual Torah is the blueprint of the eventual Jewish dominion over the world, and that he sees contemporary antisemitism, the Holocaust, and attacks against Israel as "provoked by Jews themselves." Garber concludes that MacDonald's "rambling who-is-who-isn't roundup of Jews responsible for the 'Jewish Problem' borders on the irrational and is conducive to misrepresentation."[28]

In 2001, David Lieberman, a Holocaust researcher at Brandeis University, wrote a paper entitled Scholarship as an Exercise in Rhetorical Strategy: A Case Study of Kevin MacDonald's Research Techniques, where he noted how one of MacDonald’s sources, author Jaff Schatz, objected to how MacDonald used his writings to further his premise that Jewish self-identity validates anti-Semitic sentiments and actions. “At issue, however, is not the quality of Schatz's research, but MacDonald's use of it, a discussion that relies less on topical expertise than on a willingness to conduct close comparative readings," Lieberman wrote.[29]

Mr. Anon said...

"Anonymous said...

The sword cuts both ways. The internet's caught Kevin MacDonald in his Boldfaced lying backed up by constant repetition and emotional outrage.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_B._MacDonald"

Posting the same (not even necessarily true) three paragraphs from Wikipedia on every thread, whether it is even remotely apropos or not, makes you look like a stupid a**hole. Therefore, I have to conclude that you indeed are a stupid a**hole.

Anonymous said...

Only a neocon would believe such lies.

Or at least repeat them constantly.

Good to see you back Matra, you've gone very quiet these days? You should sign up to Disqus, get stuck in mate.

Taki's Filthy Foreign Lucre said...

So the NSA gets caught spying on Merkel and we're supposed to believe that, because they denied to the French that they spied on Sarkozy, they were totally telling the truth and it was really the Mossad?
Even though there's no evidence whatsoever that it was Mossad? And even though there were reports that it was Turkey? (Funny how that part of the document didn't make it into Greenwald's story or your post. Did you run out of pixels?)

By the way, still waiting for you to correct your post grossly micharacterizing the NSA/ISNU agreement. Ha! Who am I kidding? Seriously though, did you even read the agreement or did you just trust Greenwald?

Svigor said...

Posting the same (not even necessarily true) three paragraphs from Wikipedia on every thread, whether it is even remotely apropos or not, makes you look like a stupid a**hole. Therefore, I have to conclude that you indeed are a stupid a**hole.

The funny part is how he's bragging about the fact that it took the vaunted combined intellect of global Jewry 10+ years to find three sentences of MacDonald's to object to.