tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post3154788522052258357..comments2024-03-19T02:31:02.140-07:00Comments on Steve Sailer: iSteve: The No-Drive ZoneUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger47125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-37349560323648537902011-03-28T23:51:55.224-07:002011-03-28T23:51:55.224-07:00While Sarkozy is busy saving Libyans from Gaddaffi...While Sarkozy is busy saving Libyans from Gaddaffi, the following video <br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENbB7zAM8CE&feature=player_embedded#at=356<br /><br />shows what is happening to French people in France. But then, 80% of Frenchmen love Obama and 'diversity', so are they deserving of any sympathy? <br />Much of recent French history has its roots in May 68, whose leaders took over French culture and society. Well, they asked for it.<br /><br />I wonder if the French strike at Libya betrays a kind of psychological need to reassert itself against the Muslim world. Since French Muslims cannot be touched, maybe the next best thing is to bomb Libyans all in the name of saving 'Muslims'. Perhaps, Sarkozy hopes to send a message to French Muslims that he can come down hard on them too if they get too out of order. But then, who's kidding whom?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-3166935820372423702011-03-28T11:59:28.776-07:002011-03-28T11:59:28.776-07:00The big question is what will happen when/if Gadda...The big question is what will happen when/if Gaddafi falls? Will most Libyans say 'good riddance' and work together for democracy, as in Egypt? Or, are there tribal or sectarian differences in Libya, leading to civil war to fill the political vacuum? <br />It's possible that if Iraq had been mostly Shia, most people would have welcomed Americans as liberators. But there were Sunnis.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-2934689921959185142011-03-28T11:56:45.980-07:002011-03-28T11:56:45.980-07:00It seems most Americans have no problem with blowi...It seems most Americans have no problem with blowing things up. The problem is the war getting dragged out. Vietnam War was okay for the first couple of yrs, but peopled got upset when it couldn't be won. It was also traumatic because Americans had never been defeated in a war before; similarly, Japan found surrender difficult to bear because they had a proud myth of never having been invaded by a foreign force. <br /><br />As the vietnam war dragged on, Americans got so tired that they didn't care if millions of SE Asians might be killed by communists. From 'saving humanity from communist barbarism and plot to take over the world' to 'what the hell are we doing there? it's a civil war, not our business, no matter how many people die over there.' In fact, many were saying we were killing lives in Vietnam to save lives, which 'made no sense'. Our bombs killed people who were supposed to be saved from communism.(Well, we did the same in WWII.) Even so, the main reason for anti-war demonstrations for most people was they didn't wanna fight. After all, when Nixon ended the draft, anti-war demonstrations pretty much dissipated overnight.<br /> <br />When wars are short or shorter, Americans have little or no problem. Korean War, though bloody, lasted 3 yrs. Had it dragged on for 3 more, Americans might have screamed 'bring the boys home'. Grenada invasion was popular cuz it was quick and easy. Panama Invasion also filled Americans with pride. Following the Gulf War, Bush's approval rating was 80%. 80% of Americans supported the Iraq War, and got sour only when it got worse and worse. Indeed, Bush did better in 2004 than in 2000. But as things got worse in 2005 and 2006, even conservatives lost faith in him. <br /><br />So, Americans either love wars or don't care about them, and many still think in terms of 'us good guys' vs 'those bad guys'. They grew up on superhero movies like Superman, Spiderman, and Iron Man. <br />Reagan knew this, which is why he pulled out of Lebanon. He sensed that was gonna be difficult. Reagan must have understood Sun Tzu's Art of War, where water is used as a metaphor. Water flows along 'easy' unobstructed areas, and war leaders should go for easy pickings. <br /><br />Obama's approach in Libya is speak softly and use a big stick. If big stick works, then he will speak loudly and take credit. If it doesn't work, he will dump the blame on UN and NATO. Though NATO is mostly US in terms of power and influence, most people think it's European.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-60331662267262091952011-03-27T20:46:23.690-07:002011-03-27T20:46:23.690-07:00"Is it still possible to move vehicles at nig..."Is it still possible to move vehicles at night to avoid air power?"<br /><br />No.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-35360303839384565232011-03-27T16:12:44.047-07:002011-03-27T16:12:44.047-07:00"Despite airstrikes, Tripoli residents live i..."Despite airstrikes, Tripoli residents live in terror..."<br /><br /><br />Did it say "despite" or "because of"?Truthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17286755693955361308noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-35592198391793580962011-03-27T07:40:29.299-07:002011-03-27T07:40:29.299-07:00Anonymous:
Polls are not useful for answering que...Anonymous:<br /><br />Polls are not useful for answering questions of fact that depend on expertise rather than on-the-ground experience. A poll among the public asking whether HIV causes AIDS is pointless--it's not the sort of question a non-expert is able to sensibly answer. A poll among the public asking whether they have unprotected sex with men is informative. <br /><br />In this case, we're talking about values and goals. Should we be in the business of military intervention on humanitarian grounds, in situations like that of Libya. 63% of the people in that poll said we didn't have any responsibility to do that. (Which doesn't say we shouldn't, just that we don't have to.) And the people who responded to the poll were clearly less supportive of more intrusive interventions--a smallish majority favored sanctions, it was about 50/50 for no fly zone, and then support went rapidly downhill for giving weapons to the rebels, bombing government forces, or occupying the place. <br /><br />This tells us that the American people are broadly not behind this kind of intervention, though I suspect the numbers will change to the extent that we get MSM support and political partisan support for it. Elite decisionmakers are, in general, far more supportive of military intervention in foreign countries than the public. (I suspect this has some relationship to whose kids go into the military, but perhaps I'm being unfair.)none of the abovenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-70865213737804992752011-03-26T22:28:08.157-07:002011-03-26T22:28:08.157-07:00Drudge had a link to a NYT article with the great ...Drudge had a link to a NYT article with the great headline:<br /><br />"Despite airstrikes, Tripoli residents live in terror..."<br /><br />Note that the actual NYT article had a different headline. I don't know if Drudge unwittingly did this, or is making a statement, or just taking a swipe at the Times.Mr. Anonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-11783973862544109362011-03-26T15:37:27.464-07:002011-03-26T15:37:27.464-07:00And lets get real. Obama has the Media flying air ...And lets get real. Obama has the Media flying air cover. Brian Williams, Andrea Mitchell, Katie Couric, Dianne Sawyer, and all the rest, worship him as the God that Walks Among Us. That's the real air cover.<br /><br />Obama is betting Blacks + Hispanics + SWPL elites + White Women (delivered by the Media) = victory, or close enough to cheat Al Franken style. The elections in Washington State, etc. are also a guide. Obama doesn't care about victory.<br /><br />He cares about Farrakhan. "Minister Farrakhan" as he calls the frequent visitor to the White House. He has to prove he's Black Enough(tm). So Victory in Libya is irrelevant. Simply being beloved by the Media is enough to keep it close to cheat to win. Its the Chicago Way.Whiskeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01854764809682029464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-44502409875226430092011-03-26T15:34:05.795-07:002011-03-26T15:34:05.795-07:00The US and the UK, along with France, are already ...The US and the UK, along with France, are already implementing a no-drive zone. It has allowed the rebels (who are pretty much Jihadis, btw) to retake a couple of towns.<br /><br />HOWEVER, as in Lebanon, and Iraq (during the Gulf War and Clinton), air power alone won't starve out Khadaffi. He's got billions in gold to hand out to Africa's mercenaries, from the Congo War. He's got the ability to send in saboteurs to blow up the rebels oil fields and can blow up the ones he holds. He can leverage terror networks he still has a hold on. He can use his stockpiles of poison gas he still holds. [Cutting edge tech, circa 1915.]<br /><br />Khadaffi will continue to do so, because the alternative is ending up dead. The example of Pinochet, Slobodan Milosevic, Charles Taylor, and more means Khadaffi would be a fool to give up power. He can't flee to Saudi because he tried to kill the current King. Its fight or die, and thus the only way to stop the fighting as quickly as possible is to send US armored and infantry troops to winkle him out, and kill him.Whiskeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01854764809682029464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-84437617783106441472011-03-26T15:26:58.920-07:002011-03-26T15:26:58.920-07:00Libya HAD a very large nuclear program, along with...Libya HAD a very large nuclear program, along with considerable poison gas, biological weapons, and ballistic missiles. Khadaffi brokered a deal, as Rumsfeld reminded folks, after Saddam got pulled from his spider-hole, and dismantled it in exchange for coming in out of the cold (no more sanctions, diplomatic recognition, etc.)<br /><br />Rational fear of force worked.Whiskeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01854764809682029464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-16976151572085669962011-03-26T14:40:48.304-07:002011-03-26T14:40:48.304-07:00Do polls really mean anything? In most cases, the ...Do polls really mean anything? In most cases, the answers are based all on 'feeling' than on information. Some guy will give Obama give a nice speech on Libya and think, 'yeah, I guess we are doing the right thing'.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-20861949943293860412011-03-26T14:38:48.145-07:002011-03-26T14:38:48.145-07:00That said, I believe we are not there to save civi...That said, I believe we are not there to save civilians. That is just a pretext for weakening or taking out Gaddafi.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-70644922801519967562011-03-26T14:38:04.510-07:002011-03-26T14:38:04.510-07:00"Technically, we are not intervening to win f..."Technically, we are not intervening to win for the Libyans their freedom. We are intervening to prevent civilians from getting killed. But I guess that some civilians getting killed is the price they pay for having us keep civilians from getting killed."<br /><br />If we kill 100 civilians via collateral damage to save 1000 civilians from Gaddafi's forces, we'll have saved 900. <br />Nothing is perfect in this world. <br /><br />When terrorists held hostages in a Moscow theater, Putin's actions killed some civilians in order to save most of them. Otherwise, they all might have been killed by the terrorists.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-83297114532449985442011-03-26T14:36:01.752-07:002011-03-26T14:36:01.752-07:00"It's mostly dicatorial regimes vs the pe..."It's mostly dicatorial regimes vs the people." <br /><br />"That seems like a really discordant false note. I think "it's mostly dictatorial regimes vs. the next, would-be dictatorial regime." Maybe "more islamic" should be worked in there somewhere, though."<br /><br />Maybe it will turn out that way, and indeed some revolutions end up with 'meet the new boss, same as the old boss'. But FOR NOW, in places like Egypt and Syria and even Libya, we've seen a kind of aggressive Arab counterpart to the Tea Party. I wish we could be as riled up and overthrow the Soroses and Buffetts who are ruling over us as serfs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-55439953711563540072011-03-26T11:49:17.638-07:002011-03-26T11:49:17.638-07:00It's mostly dicatorial regimes vs the people. ...<i>It's mostly dicatorial regimes vs the people. </i><br /><br />That seems like a really discordant false note. I think "it's mostly dictatorial regimes vs. the next, would-be dictatorial regime." Maybe "more islamic" should be worked in there somewhere, though.Svigorhttp://majorityrights.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-25399399476802125962011-03-26T11:34:36.304-07:002011-03-26T11:34:36.304-07:00"Anonymous said...
Some say US is killing ci..."Anonymous said...<br /><br />Some say US is killing civilians too. Well, it's the price Libyans will have to pay for their freedom."<br /><br />Technically, we are not intervening to win for the Libyans their freedom. We are intervening to prevent civilians from getting killed. But I guess that some civilians getting killed is the price they pay for having us keep civilians from getting killed.Mr. Anonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-55797421897266570332011-03-26T10:37:59.180-07:002011-03-26T10:37:59.180-07:00Anon:
As an aside, I don't know if there have...Anon:<br /><br />As an aside, I don't know if there have been anti-war protests or not. The respectable media usually doesn't cover them. Back in the rampup to the Iraq Invasion, I saw local antiwar protests with my eyes, but never in the local media. <br /><br />In fact, one really fun fact, if you look at polling data: In the runup to the Iraq invasion, about 30% of Americans opposed the invasion. In the runup to the 2010 election, about 30% of Americans supported the Tea Party. Both antiwar groups and tea partiers had big rallies. <br /><br />If you simply watched TV news, you'd never have had any idea of this fact, because as far as I recall, there was about ten times as much coverage of tea party rallies as antiwar rallies. Much of the coverage of both was hostile, focused on finding the weirdest, creepiest person at the rally and making him the public face of the movement. <br /><br />To the extent we use the MSM to learn about the world, we're a accepting wildly distorted, spun, misleading picture of the world, with many important ideas and facts simply not discussed, with untrue things repeated till "everyone knows" that _The Bell Curve_ authors advocated forced eugenics and resegregation and probably were Nazis, or "everyone knows" that Saddam had nukes he was about to give to Al Qaida, or "everyone knows" that bailing out the biggest financial companies in the US with no transparency whatsoever was the only sensible thing to do in 2008, or whatever. <br /><br />I've said this before: If you don't want to be successfully lied to, find media sources you don't agree with, ones from outside the US, ones that piss you off with their slant sometimes. And more importantly, find places where you can bypass the MSM and get at data directly. Find the raw numbers from the statistic, go read the reports published at the Pew Center (they have very readable summaries), or DJS, or CDC. There are places where you have no choice but accept the MSM reporting, because they're the ones with the reporters covering what you care about. But wherever possible, move their distorting filter out from sitting between you and reality.none of the abovenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-85435619809037329612011-03-26T07:29:32.986-07:002011-03-26T07:29:32.986-07:00Anonymous:
This March 10-13 poll paints a very di...Anonymous:<br /><br /><a href="http://people-press.org/report/715/" rel="nofollow">This March 10-13 poll</a> paints a very different picture, with most Americans pretty damned skeptical of the whole thing. Do you have a cite for your poll numbers? In this poll, the responers were split evenly on whether to enforce a no-fly zone, but massively opposed to bombing air defenses as we're doing now. (I think most responders must have thought no-fly zones didn't involve bombing air defenses and aircraft on the ground. We're actively attacking targets on the ground now, far past anything that fits into "no fly zone").none of the abovenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-70955858652797657342011-03-26T07:05:40.411-07:002011-03-26T07:05:40.411-07:00Starving pro-government Libyans, what can you do? ...Starving pro-government Libyans, what can you do? I remember seing pictures of MREs being airdropped on Afghanistan with monochrome US flags on them. If Libya's air defenses are out, then B-52s have free reign to drop whatever--bombs, food, random trash. <br /><br />Oh, wait, that would be US involvement, and we can't have that.<br /><br />--Anonymous CowardAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-32125726522593498042011-03-26T05:28:24.625-07:002011-03-26T05:28:24.625-07:00Is it still possible to move vehicles at night to ...Is it still possible to move vehicles at night to avoid air power?The Cold Equationshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05602471745036540609noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-23639204052291353682011-03-26T04:16:59.177-07:002011-03-26T04:16:59.177-07:00Keith Moon/Gaddafi.
in one famous incident Keith ...Keith Moon/Gaddafi.<br /><br />in one famous incident Keith Moon secretly rigged up The Who's speaker cabinets with high explosives timed to 'go off' at the climax of a televised performance as a 'practical joke'.<br /> Unfortunately, Moon overestimated the charge and the resulting, dangerous, explosion ruptured Pete Townshend eardrum and has left him permanently hearing impaired.<br /> An idea of Moon's fabulous drumming style can be heard in the full version of 'I won't get fooled again' (known to younger readers as the theme tune of CSI Miami), which of course also contains Pete Townshed most excellent and haunting organ solo.<br /> Performed live at Woodstock back in '71 a ranting Abbie Hoffman usurped the stage and started loudly spouting nonsense.In another famous incident Pete Townshed, famous for his 'windmilling' and guitar samshing antics, picked up his guitar and smashed Hoffman heavily over the head with it, repeatedly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-24551077598903439142011-03-26T01:46:01.575-07:002011-03-26T01:46:01.575-07:00Some say US is killing civilians too. Well, it'...Some say US is killing civilians too. Well, it's the price Libyans will have to pay for their freedom. US bombed many towns of France before landing in Normandy. Many French civilians got killed. 1000s of them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-51636971317588249132011-03-26T01:45:02.295-07:002011-03-26T01:45:02.295-07:00I predict Gaddafi will be gone in a month. He can&...I predict Gaddafi will be gone in a month. He can't win against the combination of armed rebels and NATO air power. No way.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-86180233443472802622011-03-26T01:44:00.929-07:002011-03-26T01:44:00.929-07:0060% of Americans support the Libyan War. No anti-w...60% of Americans support the Libyan War. No anti-war protests to be seen anywhere. Right is always pro-war and the Left is pro-whatever-Obama-does.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-7231277421119010882011-03-25T22:36:26.104-07:002011-03-25T22:36:26.104-07:00"Anonymous said...
How much of this is a..."Anonymous said...<br /><br /> How much of this is about Libya and how much is it about sending a message to the rest of the Middle East? By waging war on Libya to 'save civilians', the West is sending a clear message to Syria to not clamp down too hard on the protestors... which may lead to the overthrow of the Syrian regime as well."<br /><br />It sends a message that repressive states need to increase their repression - to the point that no two people can gather together in a public square and protest. I guess as long as people are only being killed in the basements of syrian police stations, that's okay.<br /><br />Incidentally, baby-face Assads' father once (I think it was sometime in the 80s) cordoned off a whole village and leveled it with artillery, in order to suppress civil disorder there.<br /><br />There is no rational way to deal with the middle east. The best thing we can do is to simply tell them: "You dudes are on your own. Good luck with all that. By the way, what's oil going for today?"Mr. Anonnoreply@blogger.com