tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post7508177237536390351..comments2024-03-15T20:52:26.967-07:00Comments on Steve Sailer: iSteve: Ishmaelia: From Evelyn Waugh's "Scoop"Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger33125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-84580444665059796442012-07-27T14:23:22.930-07:002012-07-27T14:23:22.930-07:00with online resources, more doable than ever. Also...<i>with online resources, more doable than ever. Also, how about virtual robot artificial teachers beamed to the monitor of every kid?<br /><br />WAITING FOR T-1000... T for 'teacher'.<br /><br />If kids refuse to learn, they will be terminated.</i><br /><br />How about virtual robot artificial superjock peers as well? I'm talking robotic Ogre Palowakski types. If homeschooled bourgeois brats refuse to socialize, they will be terminated.Educratnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-60622174368528659492012-07-26T02:02:39.316-07:002012-07-26T02:02:39.316-07:00The question-and-answer catechism was actually onc...<i>The question-and-answer catechism was actually once common to all Christian denominations (and the answers were almost always more detailed than a simple "yes" or "no").</i><br /><br />Grasping at straws. What about the "flat white tablet" taken after wine? The "officiant" called O'Brien? Read what Orwell says about communism and Catholicism in, e.g. THE ROAD TO WIGAN PIER and you will clearly see that he saw strong parallels between the two. I prefer Catholicism myself, mind: you get much better art and literature with the intellectual tyranny and dishonesty. Here's some of what Orwell says:<br /><br />Hence the net effect of books like this [Mirsky’s Intelligentsia of Great Britain] is to give outsiders the impression that there is nothing in Communism except hatred. And here once again you come upon that queer resemblance between Communism and (convert) Roman Catholicism. If you want to find a book as evil-spirited as The Intelligentsia of Great Britain, the likeliest place to look is among the popular Roman Catholic apologists. You will find there the same venom and the same dishonesty, though, to do the Catholic justice, you will not usually find the same bad manners. Queer that Comrade Mirsky’s spiritual brother should be Father——! The Communist and the Catholic are not saying the same thing, in a sense they are even saying opposite things, and each would gladly boil the other in oil if circumstances permitted; but from the point of view of an outsider they are very much alike.<br /><br />http://www.netcharles.com/orwell/books/wiganpier-11.htm<br /><br />Nazism, fascism, communism, Catholicism, and Orthodox Christianity have a lot more in common than geography.Adam N. Eave-Lynnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-22796097551959018182012-07-25T17:28:35.747-07:002012-07-25T17:28:35.747-07:00"Most people here aren't really intereste..."Most people here aren't really interested in HBD. Most relish the inferiority of blacks and other people. Most people here you can guess aren't the winner types of people. They are shutins in svigor or whiskey."<br /><br /><br />No, I doubt it. Because if you're a "shut in" you wouldn't have the experiences most here have had. Most people here are tired of being blamed for the genetically influenced behaviors of other races. They've seen neighborhood, schools, shopping malls, state fairs, whole cities, done in because not enough money has been transferred from working people to the masses of non-working (I don't mean the temporarily unemployed.) They are weary of paying so much for thugs' many children (the same thugs who may kill them) while they themselves cannot afford any. Or maybe one.<br />That's what brings us here. I have to come to places like this to get statistics and information on subjects the MSM considers taboo, but which is for many whites, a matter of life and death, at times.unixnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-68435005900585334872012-07-25T05:41:21.939-07:002012-07-25T05:41:21.939-07:00The question-and-answer catechism was actually onc...The question-and-answer catechism was actually once common to all Christian denominations (and the answers were almost always more detailed than a simple "yes" or "no").James Kabalahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02335302113772004687noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-53598641940464861502012-07-25T02:08:34.790-07:002012-07-25T02:08:34.790-07:00A good way for Orwell to have proved his thesis wo...<i>A good way for Orwell to have proved his thesis would have been to write novels that were better than Waugh's and Greene's.</i><br /><br />Well, he was half-way there: ANIMAL FARM and NINETEEN EIGHTY-FOUR (partly a satire on Catholicism)* are much better than anything Greene ever wrote and better than some of Waugh's weaker efforts, like HELENA and VILE BODIES. Plus, Waugh and Greene were converts and weren't good Catholics. This article also dismisses Orwell's thesis:<br /><br />Whenever there was a chance to have a shot at Catholicism in his writing, George Orwell could always be relied on to take aim and discharge both barrels. With the grim vision of Vatican support for Franco fresh in his mind, he was hardly without justification. Polemical righteousness brimming over, he rashly wrote in the 30s that the English novel was “practically a Protestant art form”, and that Catholic practitioners were thin on the ground both numerically and qualitatively. Practically as he put pen to paper however, two of the greatest English authors of the mid century – Henry Graham Greene and Arthur Evelyn St. John Waugh – were surfacing to take the literary world by ferocious storm. And it’s fair to say the pair weren’t exactly short on Catholic sensitivities. A bad call from Mr Orwell on this one at least.<br /><br />http://www.spikemagazine.com/the-literary-and-political-catholicism-of-graham-greene-and-evelyn-waugh.php<br /><br />But it then goes on to point out of Greene:<br /><br />When therefore, in the 80s a new strain of Faith within the region came to prominence which shared his vision, he could scarcely contain his intellectual glee. Liberation Theology combined the apparently antagonistic Catholicism and socialism which had both so inspired Greene, uniting against the US backed juntas of the subcontinent.<br />===<br /><br />Greene was not an orthodox Catholic, to put it mildly. After BLACK MISCHIEF, Waugh was strongly criticized by a fully orthodox Catholic journal and generously supported by an incestuous Catholic cynophile called Eric Gill. I won't ask who you think better represents the Church's line on the novel and literary freedom. If Waugh and Greene are Catholic writers who undermine Orwell's thesis, I'd hate to see a pair of Catholic writers who support it.<br /><br />*For satire on Catholicism in NINETEEN EIGHTY-FOUR, see e.g. the meeting between Winston Smith and Orwell. It's a parody of the cathecism and the mass:<br /><br />'You are prepared to cheat, to forge, to blackmail, to corrupt the minds of children, to distribute habit-forming drugs, to encourage prostitution, to disseminate venereal diseases--to do anything which is likely to cause demoralization and weaken the power of the Party?'<br /><br />'Yes.'<br /><br />'If, for example, it would somehow serve our interests to throw sulphuric acid in a child's face--are you prepared to do that?'<br /><br />'Yes.'<br /><br />[snip]<br /><br />They emptied their glasses [of wine], and a moment later Julia stood up to go. O'Brien took a small box from the top of a cabinet and handed her a flat<br />white tablet which he told her to place on her tongue. It was important, he said, not to go out smelling of wine: the lift attendants were very observant. <br /><br />http://gutenberg.net.au/ebooks01/0100021.txt<br /><br />See also Orwell's comments on Catholicism and communism in THE ROAD TO WIGAN PIER:<br /><br />http://www.netcharles.com/orwell/books/wiganpier-11.htmAdam N. Eave-Lynnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-27582342325937374302012-07-24T10:45:31.450-07:002012-07-24T10:45:31.450-07:00"Making fun of Africans is unsporting. Especi..."Making fun of Africans is unsporting. Especially if you are an HBD-er and believe that they are born this way and can't help themselves."<br /><br />Most people here aren't really interested in HBD. Most relish the inferiority of blacks and other people. Most people here you can guess aren't the winner types of people. They are shutins in svigor or whiskey.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-32918536213950107002012-07-24T07:54:09.834-07:002012-07-24T07:54:09.834-07:00It's been a while since I read the novel, but ...It's been a while since I read the novel, but the part of <i>Scoop</i> at which I remember laughing hardest is the section with the London representative of the "White" forces of Ishmaelia (the quasi-Fascists opposing the quasi-Communist "Red" forces). If memory serves, he swears up and down that a bunch of Nazi researchers visited his country, measured some skulls, and personally guaranteed that the Ishmaelians were lost Nordic Aryans (ink-black skin notwithstanding).<br /><br />I found it funny because the Nazis actually did occasionally do that sort of thing with people they were hoping to make into allies- they recruited a whole SS Division of Bosnian Muslims after deciding that they were "pure Aryans". I can't track down the specifics, but I vaguely remember hearing once that German attempts to woo Iran during the 1930s included a delegation of scientists who declared the Iranians to be "true Aryans". The hilarious irony of Germans telling Iranians that they are Aryans seems to have been lost on them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-78820977226288238072012-07-24T03:02:49.564-07:002012-07-24T03:02:49.564-07:00A good way for Orwell to have proved his thesis wo...A good way for Orwell to have proved his thesis would have been to write better novels that were better than Waugh's and Greene's.Steve Sailerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11920109042402850214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-74064178107728973002012-07-24T02:14:13.261-07:002012-07-24T02:14:13.261-07:00An important but little-discussed aspect of SCOOP:...An important but little-discussed aspect of SCOOP: Waugh kept it clean, in a deliberate attempt to get back into the Church's good books after he was condemned by Ernest Oldmeadow, of the Catholic journal THE TABLET, who was known as a mouthpiece for Cardinal Bourne, the leader of British Catholics. Waugh reacted in public with disdain, but obviously accepted what Oldmeadow said if you compare SCOOP (clean) with BLACK MISCHIEF (cannibalism, extra-marital sex, mockery of non-Catholic Christianity, etc). Note that one of Waugh's most prominent supporters during <i>l'affaire</i> Oldmeadow was the "Catholic artist" Eric Gill, who defended Waugh's right to artistic freedom. It was not known at the time how far Gill had taken his own experiments in freedom:<br /><br />In another biography (Eric Gill, London: Faber and Faber Ltd.: 1990), author Fiona MacCarthy reports that his sexual obsessions included adultery, incest, and pedophilia. Gill had sexual intercourse with his two sisters and sexually abused two of his three daughters. Yes, this is what MacCarthy states, and I found no refutations to these statements. <br /><br />http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/j005htGill_Distributism_Odou.htm<br /><br />Gill also experimented sexually with animals. So I would suggest Oldmeadow was a better representative of Catholic orthodoxy vis-a-vis Waugh's writing. The Catholic church may have overseen or inspired some of the world's greatest art, but it has never been a friend of free speech and Waugh, like Gill, was not a good Catholic: he was too anarchic and independent-minded. Orwell said this about the novel and totalitarianism:<br /><br />Orthodox Catholicism, again, seems to have a crushing effect upon certain literary forms, especially the novel. During a period of three hundred years, how many people have been at once good novelists and good Catholics? The fact is that certain themes cannot be celebrated in words, and tyranny is one of them. No one ever wrote a good book in praise of the Inquisition. Poetry might survive in a totalitarian age, and certain arts or half-arts, such as architecture, might even find tyranny beneficial, but the prose writer would have no choice between silence or death. Prose literature as we know it is the product of rationalism, of the Protestant centuries, of the autonomous individual.<br /><br />http://orwell.ru/library/essays/prevention/english/e_plit<br /><br />Cervantes is a part counter-example, but not a refutation of what Orwell says.Adam N. Eave-Lynnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-71617090218620016732012-07-23T22:59:16.964-07:002012-07-23T22:59:16.964-07:00"Making fun of Africans is unsporting. Especi..."Making fun of Africans is unsporting. Especially if you are an HBD-er and believe that they are born this way and can't help themselves."<br /><br />But we can't hep masef.<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXavZYeXEc0Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-40735998044611978102012-07-23T22:57:56.930-07:002012-07-23T22:57:56.930-07:00http://homeschooling.penelopetrunk.com/2011/11/13/...http://homeschooling.penelopetrunk.com/2011/11/13/homeschool-will-go-mainstream/<br /><br />with online resources, more doable than ever. Also, how about virtual robot artificial-intelligence teachers beamed to the monitor of every kid?<br /><br />WAITING FOR T-1000... T for 'teacher'.<br /><br />If kids refuse to learn, they will be terminated.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-24262256367082754072012-07-23T22:57:27.700-07:002012-07-23T22:57:27.700-07:00http://homeschooling.penelopetrunk.com/2011/11/13/...http://homeschooling.penelopetrunk.com/2011/11/13/homeschool-will-go-mainstream/<br /><br />with online resources, more doable than ever. Also, how about virtual robot artificial teachers beamed to the monitor of every kid?<br /><br />WAITING FOR T-1000... T for 'teacher'.<br /><br />If kids refuse to learn, they will be terminated.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-57539614666735115322012-07-23T13:37:00.283-07:002012-07-23T13:37:00.283-07:00Making fun of Africans is unsporting. Especially i...Making fun of Africans is unsporting. Especially if you are an HBD-er and believe that they are born this way and can't help themselves.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-9012729282336228872012-07-23T12:00:43.853-07:002012-07-23T12:00:43.853-07:00See also Waugh's "Black Mischief," s...See also Waugh's "Black Mischief," set in Azania (clearly patterned on Abyssinia). It is my favorite of Waugh's novels, and in a better world would have been dramatized for "Masterpiece Theater" as was "Brideshead Revisited."Crawfurdmuirnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-70643787957445053892012-07-23T10:49:04.715-07:002012-07-23T10:49:04.715-07:00"You have to build up a store of general know...<i>"You have to build up a store of general knowledge... in short, become well-read."</i><br /><br />Being well-read never hurts, but that passage is funny even if you don't get the British references. As is the whole novel. <br /><br />Also worth reading is Waugh's nonfiction book on Ethiopia, on which Scoop is based, Waugh in Abyssinia.DaveinHackensackhttp://www.thehackensack.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-34183339791678546402012-07-23T10:45:27.248-07:002012-07-23T10:45:27.248-07:00From beyond his grave Waugh is describing any numb...From beyond his grave Waugh is describing any number of U.S. cities and towns - Detroit, East St. Louis - run by negroes elected to those municipalities' offices, whose treasuries they and their appointed cronies, behind their shameless serial transparent kabuki ritual acts, promptly and thoroughly plunder along with monies drawn lavishly from state and federal treasuries in behalf of the "victims" whose neverending plight at the whim of white racists forms the raison d'être for insatiable demands for Neverending Reparations! All of which is, of course, duplicated in grand lavish style in the U.S. nation-building of Iraq and Afghanistan.<br /><br />Waugh's unrepentant social climbing ought to blind no one to his superlative unerring capacity to discern and describe in fearless and laugh-out-loud amusing prose the lines which distinguish civilization from kleptocracy, thugocracy, barbarism, and savagery. Of course Waugh's apsiration to higher civilization is nowadays déclassé - and downright doomed, as willful deliberate descent in fact and in outward form to the gutter has, since the 1960's, become all the rage.<br /><br />Those who deplore Waugh's deployment of the names of his contemporary kabuki actors to his dimwitted highfaluting characters ought to bear in mind that "there is nothing new under the sun." Were he today alive Waugh would draft into service of his scathing prose character names drawn from the monickers of today's "progressive" and Leviathan luminaries, so that we should laugh until our spleens throb painfully at characters such as Lady Condoleeza de Haut-Nez, Lord Gore, Archbishop Farrakhan Sharpton, Baroness Obama, Sir Georg von Soros, Lord Portcullis (Bill Gates), Lord Chief Justice Kennedy-Roberts, Grand Duchess Palin of the Inland Passage, Viceroy Bremer of Kut & Run, Lord Murdoch Jaune-Tabloid, Dame Oprah de Gratuité, Emperor Yeswekenya d'Obama, Field Marshall Lord Casey Powell-Petraeus McMullen, David Axelrove, Contessa Napolitano di Ciechi, Prime Minister Blare, Prime Minister Camearound, Treasury Secretary Hjalmar von Shacht-Geithner, and so on. You do, I pray, catch the drift.Auntie Analoguenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-18480737844053519152012-07-23T10:34:57.188-07:002012-07-23T10:34:57.188-07:00Perhaps Athol was this woman (give or take an &quo...Perhaps Athol was <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katharine_Stewart-Murray,_Duchess_of_Atholl" rel="nofollow">this woman</a> (give or take an "l"). There's even a Rathbone mentioned!Who's Afraid of Leonard Woolf?noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-56410175063554575452012-07-23T10:32:28.578-07:002012-07-23T10:32:28.578-07:00"Black Mischief" has a similar setting. ..."Black Mischief" has a similar setting. Normally when encountering two such similarly-themed books from the same author I'd complain (was he out of ideas?), but in his case the style and the humor are so good throughout that I'd have read 30 novels on that topic if that was how many of them he wrote.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-43898803004916584372012-07-23T09:58:01.980-07:002012-07-23T09:58:01.980-07:00It should be Atholl, not Athol. The Duchess of Ath...It should be Atholl, not Athol. The Duchess of Athol was a Conservative MP at the time, but known in the press as the "Red Duchess" because of her visit to Spain during the civil war.Kolyanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-16387386884621635602012-07-23T09:29:38.425-07:002012-07-23T09:29:38.425-07:00I was in summer camp (National Guard summer camp) ...I was in summer camp (National Guard summer camp) when a fellow trooper in the barracks threw down this paperbeck he was reading. He said something like - "Dumbest book I've ever read". I picked it up and was enchanted. Transported. Here was a writer who understood the Army as I was living it.<br /><br />That book was "Catch-22".<br /><br />From that day on I felt special. I was one of those who "got it". I was part of the cognoscentii.<br /><br />That is until - on your recommendation - I tried to read Scoop. It seemed stupid. I didn't get it. My self image plummeted.<br /><br />My happy days of contented self appreciation were over. I now saw myself as one of the rubes.<br /><br />Thanks.<br /><br />AlbertosaurusPat Boylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13477950851915567863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-40712615069835367672012-07-23T09:14:48.038-07:002012-07-23T09:14:48.038-07:00I read Scoop about a hundred years ago, long befor...I read <i>Scoop</i> about a hundred years ago, long before I had any inkling of the underpinnings of what would become HBD. I vaguely remember finding Waugh's depiction of his African state to be embarrassingly unenlightened. I clearly need to read the book again.<br /><br />- A Solid CitizenAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-86246566981362406882012-07-23T08:57:08.165-07:002012-07-23T08:57:08.165-07:00I'd guess athol jackson is named after the Duc...I'd guess athol jackson is named after the Duchess of Atholl ,Katherine Ramsay-Murray. Although she was a conservative mp she was nicknamed "the red duchess"for her anti-fascist activities (entirely unfairly;she was a vehement critic of the ussr and socialism)kaganovitchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-36929723526242385062012-07-23T07:50:22.843-07:002012-07-23T07:50:22.843-07:00Great post, Steve! it has been 25 years since I r...Great post, Steve! it has been 25 years since I read Scoop, must give it a look again.John Cunninghamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07512292512993140028noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-48619855535876360152012-07-23T07:49:23.853-07:002012-07-23T07:49:23.853-07:00If you like this, Greene's A Burnt-Out Case an...If you like this, Greene's <i>A Burnt-Out Case</i> and <i>Our Man in Havanna</i> are probably right up your street. Not quite as wacky and free-wheeling but lots of sly humo[u]r.<br /><br />Come to that, so is <i>The Third Man</i>. Greene's jibes at Americans, alphabet agencies, writers, etc. are subtle but hilarious.Kylienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-47445475662960091072012-07-23T07:28:31.848-07:002012-07-23T07:28:31.848-07:00plus ça change, plus c'est la même choseplus ça change, plus c'est la même choseAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com