tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post4067640723197235555..comments2024-03-27T18:24:19.683-07:00Comments on Steve Sailer: iSteve: Why don't the English eat horses?Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-24498215367024163552013-03-02T05:53:10.509-08:002013-03-02T05:53:10.509-08:00"He was impressed, and said, "This is pr..."He was impressed, and said, "This is pretty good meat. We must be sure to save some for the dog." <br /><br />The family had a raucous good laugh. That's when he realized just where the dog was..."<br /><br />god awful -- I want to cry -- and I'm not being facetius. While I'm not a vegetarian I feel a sort of sad emptiness at the thought of eating ,,, I've seen tpoo many pictures a haunted looking dogs & cats in Korean markets staring at psychopaths who beat them to dath slowly because it's supposed to make the meat more tasty. A Sikh guy I knew was in Korea and came home loathing them because of this. The Sikh was no animal rights activist, but he had some humanity.flickanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-76579803341015674662013-02-28T21:41:01.734-08:002013-02-28T21:41:01.734-08:00"Much of the initial work on breeding strains...<i>"Much of the initial work on breeding strains of cattle that would bulk up under cultivation was done in Britain. Before that, cattle were generalists who could live through tough times but didn't produce a lot of any single resource."</i><br /><br />True and under-appreciated. Also interesting is how <i>late</i> purposeful breeding of livestock started. This was not something lost in the mists of time:<br /><br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bakewell_%28agriculturalist%29" rel="nofollow">"Robert Bakewell (1725–1795) was a British agriculturalist, now recognized as one of the most important figures in the British Agricultural Revolution.<br /><br />Bakewell is particularly notable as the first to implement systematic selective breeding of livestock.<br /><br />...<br /><br />Robert Bakewell was the first to breed cattle to be used primarily for beef. Previously, cattle were first and foremost kept for pulling ploughs as oxen[citation needed], but he crossed long-horned heifers and a Westmoreland bull to eventually create the Dishley Longhorn. As more and more farmers followed his lead, farm animals increased dramatically in size and quality. In 1700, the average weight of a bull sold for slaughter was 370 pounds (168 kg). By 1786, that weight had more than doubled to 840 pounds (381 kg)."</a><br /><br />Bakewell directly influenced Darwin:<br /><br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bakewell_%28agriculturalist%29" rel="nofollow">"In On the Origin of Species he cited Bakewell's work as demonstrating variation under domestication, in which methodical breeding during Bakewell's lifetime led to considerable modification of the forms and qualities of his cattle, ..."</a><br /><br />That must have surely given Darwin confidence.<br /><br />This was so recent that it might not have influenced the horse meat taboo. But England might still have had more beef than most places. Weren't many of those raids on France during the Hundred Years War basically cattle raids? I can't see how the Normans, who imposed <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_forest#Forest_law" rel="nofollow">forest law</a> to protect game animals and the forests they lived in, by prohibiting what the general population could hunt, would allow the country to get a taste for horse meat. Or themselves to eat, for that matter. `Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-14846841151504776312013-02-28T12:34:01.140-08:002013-02-28T12:34:01.140-08:00" Horses and dogs are the only two animals th..." Horses and dogs are the only two animals that will die for their master. Only horses and dogs are used for emotional therapy."<br /><br />So are cats. And I have some awesome stories about cats who tried defending their people. They are not exactly to be counted on in that way, as dogs, but some are pretty protective to the extent they can be. Also eerily psychic. When I was having a rough time on the road, my cat was always at the window waiting with an anxious look on his face. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-22081172842118152172013-02-28T12:25:00.660-08:002013-02-28T12:25:00.660-08:00Why don't the English eat horsemeat?
Because ...Why don't the English eat horsemeat?<br /><br />Because beef was plentiful. Much of the initial work on breeding strains of cattle that would bulk up under cultivation was done in Britain. Before that, cattle were generalists who could live through tough times but didn't produce a lot of any single resource.<br /><br />The same thing has happened with crop plants - the generalist strains that didn't produce wildly have been discarded in favor of specialized strains that require pampering but produce wildly.Melendwyrhttp://occludedsun.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-6436115196328210472013-02-27T20:47:26.332-08:002013-02-27T20:47:26.332-08:00I agree with the cannibalism way of thinking - exc...I agree with the cannibalism way of thinking - except i think that way of thinking might only take hold in places that had better meat available anyway e.g. beef?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-69782503274439682092013-02-27T15:20:44.680-08:002013-02-27T15:20:44.680-08:00I don't know, I'd happily eat them (and pr...I don't know, I'd happily eat them (and probably have!). Sure they are magnificent animals, but they are not nearly as smart as pigs - and pigs are delicious.<br /><br />I'm not sure there's really much visceral concern among most Brits over this 'scare'.Simon in Londonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-45016501857694902082013-02-27T15:02:53.205-08:002013-02-27T15:02:53.205-08:00There was a time in the mid to late 70s when many ...There was a time in the mid to late 70s when many US supermarkets sold horse meat. It did not last that long but there was no widespread outcry against it, it just wan't a preferred flavor of meat.<br /><br /> I have eaten horsemeat on several occasions and found it pleasant when cooked properly. I'd eat it if it were it served here.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-14651708403852488992013-02-27T13:43:31.697-08:002013-02-27T13:43:31.697-08:00@anon 7:52 AM
You wrote that hares are so elusive...@anon 7:52 AM<br /><br />You wrote that hares are so elusive,<i>"even the typical countryside dweller might go his whole life without seeing one in the wild"</i>.<br /><br />Where do you live?<br /><br />In suburban central NJ, they are everywhere in the summer months. They breed like rabbits!<br /><br />Their only predators seem to be cats, as far as I can tell. I've often wondered if anyone eats them anymore. <br /><br />There might be a problem with their wholesomeness, though - they eat a diet of grass heavily polluted with fertilizer and other chemicals.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-3633299109817446172013-02-27T12:30:12.048-08:002013-02-27T12:30:12.048-08:00If cars were made of flesh and blood no one would ...<i>If cars were made of flesh and blood no one would eat them for the same reason that most people declined to eat horse: you don't consume your cheapest, most dependable mode of transport.<br /><br />I have to stop thinking about this topic, lest I allow it to get my goat.</i><br /><br />That might work if horses had ever been the cheapest, most dependable mode of transport, but they haven't.<br /><br />Horses were for people with money. Donkeys and mules were how most people got around.Svigornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-70315419357313753442013-02-27T12:15:50.116-08:002013-02-27T12:15:50.116-08:00Steve, you should write an article about horse gen...Steve, you should write an article about horse genealogy and how it compares to HBD. <br /><br />I had a discussion recently with an avid horse racing fan about the insane prices that are paid for well-bred race horses. <br /><br />Horses are not all equal, at least not according to the marketplace.<br /><br />When it comes to people, though...<br /><br />Suggested title: "Horses for Courses."<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-3929055976469630932013-02-27T11:00:33.758-08:002013-02-27T11:00:33.758-08:00Veal is nearly always baby (dairy) bull, not baby ...Veal is nearly always baby (dairy) bull, not baby (dairy) cow. Not much call for extra xy-bovines on a dairy farm, unless the breeding bull or any draft oxen (if the operation is organic/traditional) are about to be retired. Veal has its roots in the principle "waste not, want not", like most food traditions.normannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17358715755873851074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-67380151037234609242013-02-27T10:59:40.142-08:002013-02-27T10:59:40.142-08:00How Christianity stopped Anglo-Saxon England eatin...<i>How Christianity stopped Anglo-Saxon England eating horsemeat: Church officials claimed it was 'pagan' food</i><br /><br />Very likely - also horsemeat might have bean "peasant" food too. The lords didn't eat it, and soon enough it would be shameful for commoners to do the same.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-44074756932366340032013-02-27T09:40:58.088-08:002013-02-27T09:40:58.088-08:00That most of those who won't eat horse have li...That most of those who won't eat horse have little problem serving it to other animals shows that the taboo is fundamentally based on our relationship to the animal. Horses and dogs are the only two animals that will die for their master. Only horses and dogs are used for emotional therapy. They are part of the family--the more so a society is civilized. We aren't cannibals. We don't just name horses, we treat them as individuals, even heroes: Rocinante, Bucephalus, etc. No other animal could have replaced the protagonist in the Black Stallion. A man feels one with a horse when riding him. Remember that small-L liberalism, with its respect for persons, has long flourished in England. It is no accident that the epitome of cruelty in Brothers Karamazov is the ragged horse being whipped in its eye.<br /><br />Also, as Aristotle noted, horses are the most beautiful animal. Why sacrifice beauty for mere utility unless you absolutely have to? We are not barbarians. I can't think of any beautiful animal we eat, except for exceedingly rare songbirds.<br /><br />"All you need for happiness is a good gun, a good horse, and a good wife."--Daniel Boone<br /><br />High Horsenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-41708248110752891582013-02-27T09:23:58.645-08:002013-02-27T09:23:58.645-08:00This Anglo-Saxon has no personal ban on consuming ...This Anglo-Saxon has no personal ban on consuming horse meat. I don't think it makes much sense. If we're going to keep horses, why not put them to good use when their time's up?Svigornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-1897390990940055352013-02-27T08:11:35.699-08:002013-02-27T08:11:35.699-08:00(I posted this on the Bacon Cocktail thread in err...(I posted this on the Bacon Cocktail thread in error, when it was meant for this one. Sorry to inflict it twice.)<br /><br />Shaggy dog story: In grad school I worked in the library sorting maps. My boss told me that the fellow who had the job before me saved his cash and made a bike tour of the Philippine countryside. <br /><br />He told her that at one rural home he spent an afternoon playing with the family dog. Later, they invited him in for dinner, and made a big deal out of it as he was probably the first foreign guest they'd ever had. <br /><br />He was impressed, and said, "This is pretty good meat. We must be sure to save some for the dog." <br /><br />The family had a raucous good laugh. That's when he realized just where the dog was...Reg Cæsarnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-48236700743638018522013-02-27T07:52:37.689-08:002013-02-27T07:52:37.689-08:00The taboo on eating hare is an interesting one. Th...The taboo on eating hare is an interesting one. These animals are damned elusive, and even the typical countryside dweller might go his whole life without seeing one in the wild. The biblical explanation is unconvincing, as rabbits are and always have been widely eaten across Europe. I guess the latter are simply much easier to catch, and the relative difficulty of catching the hare eventually morphs into a respect for his survival instinct and thus a feedback loop is formed. No coincidence that horse and hare are both supreme athletes, while pig, sheep and rabbit aren't.<br /><br />Also, I suspect hare doesn't taste too good. Even so, it is a surprisingly heavily mythologized animal.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-62611383056505580812013-02-27T07:16:06.742-08:002013-02-27T07:16:06.742-08:00"You think they served us cuz they were '..."You think they served us cuz they were 'noble'? They had no choice."<br /><br />I don't think anyone has ever thought that horses had moral agency. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-20522869934235584832013-02-27T06:57:51.823-08:002013-02-27T06:57:51.823-08:00Tough old horses probably taste tough and old. Whe...Tough old horses probably taste tough and old. When the British were flogging aging milk-cart horses to death on icy streets in the 30s, it probably wasn't sentimentality that kept them from eating horse. And since widespread malnutrition (naked bone-skinny people along river streets) was normal in England through the 30s, any very strong sentiment would have been up against a real enemy. Cat's Meat's Man, appalled at eating horse? Coney-catchers, shocked? <br /><br /><br />Self-righteous lies from grass-fed advertising aside, tasty animals are the ones that spend most of their lives just standing around getting fat and juicy. England is good country for sheep, who stand around getting fat and tasty. Again, Frog-eaters and other wogs starting at Calais eat horse, thus, no non-homosexual Briton would.<br /><br />Or maybe horse tastes too good to be wasted on British cooks.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-7437568342548451452013-02-27T05:49:29.880-08:002013-02-27T05:49:29.880-08:00They don't eat 'em, just make glue out of ...They don't eat 'em, just make glue out of 'emGoobernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-50478883804181793812013-02-27T05:48:11.751-08:002013-02-27T05:48:11.751-08:00" We are Brahmins; we dont eat any meat."..." We are Brahmins; we dont eat any meat."<br /><br /><br />Brahmins can't hold themselves up in too high of a light for their culinary habits, they've got that whole "pee drinking" thing going on.Saul A.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-50455947450800491732013-02-27T00:52:07.036-08:002013-02-27T00:52:07.036-08:00The Battle of Waterloo - Charge of the British Hea...The Battle of Waterloo - Charge of the British Heavy Cavalry<br /><br />http://youtu.be/7vlcuvrM1po<br /><br />With Fire and Sword<br /><br />http://youtu.be/mD6UkzJs9h0?t=44s<br /><br />big country<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ogmIDd040UAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-31771330198882473212013-02-27T00:41:22.917-08:002013-02-27T00:41:22.917-08:00"horses are noble creatures, served humans fo..."horses are noble creatures, served humans for hundreds of years."<br /><br />You think they served us cuz they were 'noble'? They had no choice. And they served all sides. Horses carried the mongol horde to Russia to pillage and rape women. No, I don't blame horses, but they serve any master who rides them. That aint noble. Now dogs don't serve all masters. That's why they are special. <br /><br />It's like War Horse the movie. Horse will serve all sides. <br /><br />I say let's not kill horses because they are magnificent and beautiful. 'Fascist' reason? So what?<br />And I say let's not kill pigs because they are smart. Also, the original wild boar is a great looking beask. It aint pretty but it's striking. When domesticated pigs are released into the wild, they eventually regain their ferocious form.<br /><br />Kurosawa had a great way with horses. <br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlcLQho9MpIAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-23559046778446203112013-02-27T00:38:37.011-08:002013-02-27T00:38:37.011-08:00Apparently the french only took to eating horse in...Apparently the french only took to eating horse in a big way after the deprivations of the siege of Paris in the Franco-Prussian war.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-44347232020250481042013-02-27T00:35:49.026-08:002013-02-27T00:35:49.026-08:00But the English never had a problem feeding horse ...But the English never had a problem feeding horse meat to cats and dogs.<br /> I don't know the source of the taboo. I suspect that in former times horses were working animals and never kept as livestock as such, after a lifetime of work, they were killed when no longer useful, therefore the carcass was, i a way, not deemed as 'farm raised meat', but waste of sorts.<br /> In fact the horse-knancker made use of every part of the horse, the skin was used for leather, the mane was used for plastering walls, the meat boiled up and sold in the street as 'cats and dogs meat', the bones and hoofs boiled up to make wood glue and gelatine.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-32760176407822822972013-02-26T23:31:52.789-08:002013-02-26T23:31:52.789-08:00Venison is considered a delicacy despite "Bam...Venison is considered a delicacy despite "Bambi". <br /><br />Coming back to the Anglo-Saxon fondness for things equine, the British community in Peking started taking the incipient Boxer Revolution seriously only after they burnt down the Peking Turf Club. And every major Eastern city in the British Empire (Hong Kong, Singapore, Kuala Lumpur, Penang) had its Turf Club.BrokenSymmetryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00817998587641971683noreply@blogger.com