tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post4275648925612379836..comments2024-03-27T18:24:19.683-07:00Comments on Steve Sailer: iSteve: Sailer: "The Strange Evolution of Eugenics"Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger78125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-2177352328676912182014-05-15T13:19:39.413-07:002014-05-15T13:19:39.413-07:00off topic but somehow relevant - contraceptive and...off topic but somehow relevant - contraceptive and feminist pioneer Marie Stopes' only son has died.<br /><br />http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/10831328/Harry-Stopes-Roe-obituary.html<br /><br /><i>"An only child, Harry Verdon Stopes-Roe, born on March 27 1924, was forbidden by his mother from reading books (she felt that reading encouraged second-hand opinions) and forced to wear skirts until the age of 11 because she did not believe in the “ugly and heating-in-the-wrong-places garments which most men are condemned to wear”; for the same reason he was forbidden to ride a bicycle.<br /><br />She had given birth to him at the age of 44, after which she was told she could have no more children. Convinced that her new son needed a companion, she advertised for “a little boy between the ages of 20 months and 2¼ years” with a view to adoption, specifying that the child should be “absolutely healthy, intelligent and not circumcised”."</i><br /><br />Unlike his mother, Harry fathered four children with the daughter of the aircraft and bomb designer Barnes Wallis. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-21319591810108643292014-05-15T10:57:59.517-07:002014-05-15T10:57:59.517-07:00"For a genetics-obsessed blog, surely you sho..."For a genetics-obsessed blog, surely you should wonder why blacks in America have come in all sorts of hues, ranging from completely black to close-to-white." - because they have a 17% european admixture, which is a far cry from the situation in Brazil, much less what happened to the slaves taken to the middle east. I haven't seen any US specific data on how many blacks here have a european Y chromosome so I couldn't break that down in greater detail for you. Also complicating the issue is the post civil war dieoff of around a quarter of the recently liberated slaves, but regardless, if they opposed miscegenation, society was going in their direction.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-60743978078256198542014-05-15T09:34:51.367-07:002014-05-15T09:34:51.367-07:00Slavery is bad. Whipping people is bad. kidnapping...Slavery is bad. Whipping people is bad. kidnapping free men into bondage is also bad.<br /><br />Now that that's said let's try to separate myth from reality. <br /><br />12 years a Slave maybe happened or maybe not. If it did happen exactly as written - it was a very minor incident. White men were kidnapped into bondage on a large scale both before and long after that solitary incident.<br /><br />Kidnappings free men for service on sailing ships wasn't just common - we fought a war over it. The facts are well known. Read the Hornblower novels. he routinely sends gangs out to waylay free men in bars and taverns who will be taken aboard his ships. They will be worked by special crew who beat them daily. If they misbehave they will be flogged. The evidence is that naval floggings were more severe than those on Southern plantations. Slave floggings stopped with Emancipation. Great Britain kept flogging impressed sailors through the 1890s. Listen to 'HMS Pinafore'.<br /><br />Slaves working on farms ate more calories, more vitamins, and more vegetables than sailors who subsisted on wormy dried biscuit and salt pork. Slaves lived longer than sailors. Often much longer. There are no jobs in the fields as dangerous as the top gallants in a storm or anywhere in a battle.<br /><br />Most slaves on the big antebellum cotton plantations lived in united families in single family houses. Sailors had 18 inches for their hammocks. In port the sailors were locked below deck. After a voyage of several years the returning sailors were often recaptured by another ship. The odds of surviving two or three such voyages in a row were not good. <br /><br />Most slaves in the US had gardens. Sailors had scurvy.<br /><br />The British army at the time also got it's troops by force and the beat them too - occasionally to death. <br /><br />Quentin Tarentino is not a reliable historian. '12 years a Slave' was written as a propaganda piece but it may be nonetheless true. Even so it is not representative of Southern plantation life.<br /><br />Pat BoylePat Boylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13477950851915567863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-83471049089409768182014-05-15T07:06:22.764-07:002014-05-15T07:06:22.764-07:00Anonymous:"All the talk of anglo-saxons in Am...Anonymous:"All the talk of anglo-saxons in America conveniently ignores the fact that ever since the 11th century Norman invasion and conquest<br />the normans have constituted the upper class of England and the anglo-saxons the underclass."<br /><br />And the insanity keeps on coming!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-76540347608437613492014-05-15T03:01:30.392-07:002014-05-15T03:01:30.392-07:00@peterike,
Yes, the slave-owners set such a nice e...@peterike,<br /><i>Yes, the slave-owners set such a nice example of family values and non-promiscuity by having sexual relations with their female slaves (married or unmarried), and by occasionally selling off husband, wife, and kids to different buyers.<br /><br />The slave-owners also set a great example of non-violence by brutally whipping their slaves for various crimes like trying to escape to freedom.<br />--------------------------------------------------<br /><br />Get all your history from Hollywood, I see. </i><br /><br />And you probably get your history from The Diaries of a Mississippi Slaveowner.<br /><br />For a genetics-obsessed blog, surely you should wonder why blacks in America have come in all sorts of hues, ranging from completely black to close-to-white.<br /><br />And are you seriously saying slaves didn't get worked like horses, or whipped for trying to run away?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-11947997072128699572014-05-15T02:01:14.918-07:002014-05-15T02:01:14.918-07:00"Goddard is a Norman surname rather than an A..."Goddard is a Norman surname rather than an Anglo one."<br /><br />All the talk of anglo-saxons in America conveniently ignores the fact that ever since the 11th century Norman invasion and conquest<br />the normans have constituted the upper class of England and the anglo-saxons the underclass. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-86012999801990141722014-05-14T22:05:20.121-07:002014-05-14T22:05:20.121-07:00Was it only in 1870 that contraceptives became ava...Was it only in 1870 that contraceptives became available? Characters in earlier novels seem to have the ability to control family size. For example in Vanity Fair Becky Sharpe has a baby nine months after her wedding, and that's it despite numerous affairs. And there's a bit in Trollope where a lady is complaining about her marital woes, making it clear that she is sleeping with her husband. But when her sister suggests that she have a baby, she says "I don't want one" and they both seem to feel it's as simple as that.<br /><br />I suppose anyone who's read the Bible would know about the withdrawal method...Annenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-41046182033174967072014-05-14T20:53:31.793-07:002014-05-14T20:53:31.793-07:00"Even in super-organized Nazi Germany bribes ..."Even in super-organized Nazi Germany bribes mattered. Wernher von Braun have chosen ethyl alcohol as the fuel for his V-2 rockets, so that he could use it for pushing his technical orders for some or other parts, trading them for ethyl alcohol."<br /><br />That's interesting. I wonder if this goes on in China at the manufacturing level? I purchased a small Lakewood fan several years and was AMAZED to discover that instead of your standard synchronous 60Hz electric motor used since the dawn of time, it used a CAPACITOR START motor, the smallest I have ever seen. I can only speculate that the fan designers SPECIFIED such a device in order for someone to get an order at a capacitor factory.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-77480102992475132392014-05-14T20:22:27.254-07:002014-05-14T20:22:27.254-07:00As the Augustinian monk, theologian, and “first Pr...<i>As the Augustinian monk, theologian, and “first Protestant” Martin Luther viewed his world in the second decade of the 16th Century, he saw a Christianity in conflict with family life and fertility. Church tradition held that the taking of vows of chastity—as a priest, monk, or cloistered sister—was spiritually superior to the wedded life. In consequence, about one-third of adult European Christians were in Holy Orders.</i> <a href="http://www.crisismagazine.com/2012/how-protestants-learned-to-love-the-pill" rel="nofollow">Crisis Magazine</a><br /><br />Seems like The Church had a pretty good voluntary eugenics program, where the participants derived satisfaction from following in the steps of their divine leader. Luther messed the whole thing up, pressuring everyone to procreate to please The Lord.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-69846227321441379922014-05-14T19:30:39.203-07:002014-05-14T19:30:39.203-07:00It's not like the corporate lawyers of yestery...<i>It's not like the corporate lawyers of yesteryear were marrying 85-IQ, big-boobed cigarette girls. That was a joke even back then.</i><br /><br />ObRef: DIFFERENT WORLDS<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-42986675531271393002014-05-14T18:30:12.699-07:002014-05-14T18:30:12.699-07:00Black>Hispanic>White>Asian
Pablo Cuervo ... Black>Hispanic>White>Asian<br /><br />Pablo Cuervo Gut and A Kalahari Bushman are attractive? Fair enough! Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-57159658323637081182014-05-14T18:02:40.522-07:002014-05-14T18:02:40.522-07:00The assortative mating thing is overblown. If you ...The assortative mating thing is overblown. If you see a couple today where the man is a heart surgeon and the woman is a Ph.D. psychologist, 50 years ago that same couple would have been a heart surgeon and a housewife who dropped out of her junior year at Smith to get married.<br /><br />Looks different but they're the same two people with the same sets of genes. The housewife Smith dropouts got bored and invented feminism so their daughters could be psychologists. It's not like the corporate lawyers of yesteryear were marrying 85-IQ, big-boobed cigarette girls. That was a joke even back then.Jean Cocteaustennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-87961542293698481002014-05-14T17:47:28.077-07:002014-05-14T17:47:28.077-07:00Excellent article.Excellent article.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-4365948743593175062014-05-14T17:22:26.451-07:002014-05-14T17:22:26.451-07:00Yes, the slave-owners set such a nice example of f...<i> Yes, the slave-owners set such a nice example of family values and non-promiscuity by having sexual relations with their female slaves (married or unmarried), and by occasionally selling off husband, wife, and kids to different buyers.<br /><br />The slave-owners also set a great example of non-violence by brutally whipping their slaves for various crimes like trying to escape to freedom. </i><br /><br />Get all your history from Hollywood, I see. peterikenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-52540634346256999362014-05-14T16:50:13.334-07:002014-05-14T16:50:13.334-07:00@ gentleman with question about 180 degrees post-G...@ gentleman with question about 180 degrees post-Griswold:<br /><br />My sister provided some insight into your question when she ran a PP clinic in the early'90's. Black women reported that black men refused to use condoms, and would hit them if they tried to insist. So that scene in Idiocracy was actually overly flattering to blacks.Get a Glocknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-49111411279363602832014-05-14T16:26:17.467-07:002014-05-14T16:26:17.467-07:00anonymous:"I guess you missed all the comment...anonymous:"I guess you missed all the commenters on this blog doggedly insisting that Edmund Burke (among numerous other Hiberno-Normans) was "Anglo-Norman" or "Old English" and not Irish - because, you see, Burke is a Norman surname originally and not an Irish one. Goose, gander."<br /><br />I must have blocked it out. Some things are simply too silly to contemplate.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-22528457337961962014-05-14T16:23:49.289-07:002014-05-14T16:23:49.289-07:00Steve:"Upper class British women had access t...Steve:"Upper class British women had access to contraceptive devices from the 1870s onward. William Manchester's biography of Churchill takes up the question of why his mother didn't have anymore children after age 24, despite a lifetime of flamboyant romances. He describes a discreet shop in London where a well-dress lady with a letter of introduction from a society lady could buy contraceptives."<br /><br />I seem to recall something similar about Henry Adams' wife Marian. Perhaps it was in Brookhiser's volume on the Adams' family. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-25489352604165816162014-05-14T15:33:20.728-07:002014-05-14T15:33:20.728-07:00Anonymous:"Goddard is a Norman surname rather...<i>Anonymous:"Goddard is a Norman surname rather than an Anglo one."</i> <br /><br /><br /><i>This might just be the most deranged comment that I have ever read on this blog. And that is saying quite a lot.</i> <br /><br /><br />I guess you missed all the commenters on this blog doggedly insisting that Edmund Burke (among numerous other Hiberno-Normans) was "Anglo-Norman" or "Old English" and not Irish - because, you see, Burke is a Norman surname originally and not an Irish one. Goose, gander.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-48286589961801427402014-05-14T15:27:03.640-07:002014-05-14T15:27:03.640-07:00I know Roissy/Heartiste is a big fan of Galton pos...I know Roissy/Heartiste is a big fan of Galton positive eugenics, i.e. smart guys marrying attractive women.<br /><br />However, I see one big problem there. Feminine free will.<br /><br />Smart guys are repulsive to women, on average. This is because higher IQ correlates negatively with testosterone levels. From a pure sexual standpoint, no one has disproven Satoshi Kanazawa's study, the hierarchy of attractiveness for men (by women of all races): Black>Hispanic>White>Asian. Reversed of course for the attractiveness of women by men of all races, and also found in his study. There has been point-sputter outrage to Kanazawa, but no independent studies disproving his results. Just witchfinding.<br /><br />What makes men attractive to women, the prerequisite basically with feminine free will and free choice, to child-bearing, is: high levels of aggressiveness, lower IQ, darker skin, higher testosterone, lower future time orientation (i.e. impulsiveness), social orientation, extraversion, height, social dominance, athleticism, violent and dangerous behavior (this last is proven by Sailer's "Chicks dig Chechens" line).<br /><br />None of that describes higher IQ White guys. Higher IQ, smarter White guys have to settle. For what they can get. Even Game will only take them so far, though it is important to master it.<br /><br />No matter how much a guy lifts, stifles his inner beta male, performs in an improv manner in the way of an Alpha male, he will still lack the genuine article.<br /><br />ANY sort of positive eugenics has to take into account the disparate ways in which men and women measure sexiness. For men it is youth, pale(r) skin, beauty, etc. For women it is dark(er) skin than themselves, violence, aggression, lower IQ, etc.<br /><br />Any program of positive eugenics will simply result in a Mulatto nation, because that is what women want.<br /><br />Therefore I advocate AS MUCH SOCIAL REPRESSION for everyone as possible. Japan-like repression in matters of sex and reproduction at least has helped them avoid becoming Brazil. A melange of Mulatto underachievers, but with the kind of thug-violent men women can't get enough of. Yes this impinges on sexual freedom (basically women's and Alpha males, beta males have none being wanted only for beta male bucks).<br /><br />Japan, South Korea, Coastal China, might have a falling or plunging birth rate but at least are not filled with a dominant Mulatto underclass wanting things it can never create the wealth to pay for.Whiskeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01854764809682029464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-50905217183215168152014-05-14T14:55:23.847-07:002014-05-14T14:55:23.847-07:00Upper class British women had access to contracept...Upper class British women had access to contraceptive devices from the 1870s onward. William Manchester's biography of Churchill takes up the question of why his mother didn't have anymore children after age 24, despite a lifetime of flamboyant romances. He describes a discreet shop in London where a well-dress lady with a letter of introduction from a society lady could buy contraceptives. <br /><br />Gregory Clark finds that the fertility rate of the wealthy in Britain collapsed around 1880.<br /><br />Much of the political struggle over contraception was over laws criminalizing publication of information about how to do it. WASP progressives tended to support Sanger since they knew how to do it from their quiet channels, but wanted the Catholics to be able to learn easily so they wouldn't outnumber them. Thus, that Monty Python clip I often link to.Steve Sailerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11920109042402850214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-13730369067338477742014-05-14T14:50:49.572-07:002014-05-14T14:50:49.572-07:00What about Anglo bicycle mechanics and Aerodynamic...What about Anglo bicycle mechanics and Aerodynamics? That's physics right?Roger Baconnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-66322871751648874572014-05-14T14:47:27.569-07:002014-05-14T14:47:27.569-07:00Steve's clearheaded writing on eugenics over t...Steve's clearheaded writing on eugenics over the years raises an interesting question, which I am not remotely qualified to answer: Does widespread contraceptive use actually have "eugenic" effects, as its early proponents claimed? In the days of Margaret Sanger, it was naturally assumed that if condoms were widespread, those with poor self-control and low intelligence would avoid a whole lot of accidental pregnancies, with a corresponding reduction in the number of children growing up to be burdens on the public- "More children from the fit, and fewer from the unfit".<br /><br />In retrospect, though, is there a strong case to be made that the effect is 180 degrees the reverse? This is just my vague impression (I'm Catholic, for what it's worth), not supported by any kind of data. It seems to me, though, that intelligent, self-disciplined, and careful people (who could probably do a pretty good job of caring for an unplanned child) also should be the best at remembering to carry rubbers or pop pills on schedule. Conversely, aren't Sanger's legions of the "unfit" the ones most likely to forget condoms in the car, break them by opening the package wrong, or neglect to take the pill on time? It seems likely that contraceptives would drastically depress birthrates amongst the smart and well-prepared ("<i>We can't have a child in </i>this<i> market</i>"). Amonst the unintelligent and impulsive, though, the atmosphere of uninhibited randiness in our post-Griswold world probably creates almost as many unplanned pregnancies as condoms prevent, if not more (Steve has previously cited a very similar effect observed in the early days of legalized abortion). A telling deleted scene in Idiocracy depicts Clevon and his latest floozy getting hot and heavy in his truck, at which point he says, panicking, "<i>Aw, I forgot to bring rubbers!</i>". A torrent of hormones easily overpowering his already-meager ability to plan for the future, he continues with the proceedings nonetheless.<br /><br />Has there ever been a formal study done on this? <i>Is</i> there any way to do a formal study on this? The main problem nowadays seems to be that non-contraceptors are already a pretty strongly self-selected bunch, often members of intensely religious subcultures. It'd be hard to do an apples-to-apples comparison with everyone else and extrapolate the results to an entire society and culture. Are there any good data from the period before contraceptives were legalized in Ireland and a few other Catholic European countries, by which they might be compared with their neighbors? We know that birthrates are down dramatically since the invention of The Pill, but we don't seem to know whether the ratio of "smart" births to "dumb" births has changed as a result. My hunch is that when contraceptives aren't an easy option, smart couples generally have a few more children than they would otherwise, while not-so-smart couples have about the same number. Has it ever been measured formally?<br /><br />Incidentally, I know Steve has mentioned long-lasting depo-provera shots as a form of contraception more likely to be effective amongst the left half of the bell curve, but I'm not so sure. It's certainly more effective for those who are actually subjected to it, but it doesn't escape the problem of the general cultural changes that accompany widespread contraceptive use. If you're not very bright, and your older sister takes DP and decides to become The Village Bicycle, how likely are you to start imitating her behavior even though you aren't taking the same shots? Do randy young men check young ladies' medical records before jumping in the sack? Much of human behavior is imitative; we do what everyone else thinks is normal. Maybe this doesn't matter, but it seems like a question worth considering.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-84683139630635190992014-05-14T14:47:14.947-07:002014-05-14T14:47:14.947-07:00Or the ChronometerOr the ChronometerRoger Baconnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-65338162942866211382014-05-14T14:46:55.086-07:002014-05-14T14:46:55.086-07:00Or gravity?Or gravity?Roger Baconnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-88298460387038905812014-05-14T14:36:39.088-07:002014-05-14T14:36:39.088-07:00Anonymous:"Goddard is a Norman surname rather...Anonymous:"Goddard is a Norman surname rather than an Anglo one."<br /><br />This might just be the most deranged comment that I have ever read on this blog. And that is saying quite a lot.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com