tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post4353183640458252712..comments2024-03-28T16:22:14.888-07:00Comments on Steve Sailer: iSteve: Bill James' All-Time Best Baseball Players by EthnicityUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-60575525052843164762007-12-11T00:22:00.000-08:002007-12-11T00:22:00.000-08:00To do this study correctly, you must break down th...To do this study correctly, you must break down the hispanics into groups as well, example black-David Ortiz, white-Luis Gonzalez, and natives-Rodrigo Lopez.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-34008159343195289372007-08-08T15:23:00.000-07:002007-08-08T15:23:00.000-07:00Latin American players may well be bigger than the...Latin American players may well be bigger than they used to be, perhaps partly due to better diets and public health in Latin America, perhaps partly due to the easy availability off steroids.Steve Sailerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11920109042402850214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-3973031899851554622007-07-13T04:13:00.000-07:002007-07-13T04:13:00.000-07:00Steve you really should leave baseball alone. It s...Steve you really should leave baseball alone. It seems that after the demise of your silly and discredited "Freeswinging Latins" theory you're looking for something new...but not finding it.<BR/><BR/>By the way, it's astonishing that you used the time frame of 1875-2000 instead of 1947-2000.<BR/><BR/>Moreover, your headline implies Bill James' endorsement of your list. Probably not unethical, but certainly polemical. And not at all intellectual.<BR/><BR/>Finally, baseball, like all other things, changes.<BR/><BR/>For example, in the 1980s, 47% of all at-bats by players with Hispanic surnames were by middle infielders (2b or ss). From 2001-2006, that number dropped to 37% -- not because there are fewer Hispanic shortstops or second basemen (there are more of both) -- but because more Hispanics are playing more positions.<BR/><BR/>By the way, players with Hispanic surnames have had marginally better OBP and OPS statistics than all other players combined since at least around 2000, if not before.<BR/><BR/>Part of the reason for this? Because Hispanic players are no longer concentrated so heavily on weaker-hitting positions.<BR/><BR/>If memory serves, 4 of the top 10 current career OPS leaders were born in or lived in Latin America (not just Hispanic surname). I think 2 of the top 10 all-time career OPS leaders are Hispanic, which is somewhat remarkable given that Hispanic players didn't hit the 20% threshold until the 1990s -- and already 2 are in the top 10 all-time.<BR/><BR/>Lenny Dykstra sure was nails though in 1986. One of my fondest memories is of Ray Knight scoring the winning run as Mookie Wilson hit the ball through Bill Buckner's legs (Kevin Mitchell scored the tying run and Gary Carter got them within one).<BR/><BR/>Vin Scully's call was great: "So the winning run is at second base, with two outs, three and two to Mookie Wilson. (A) little roller up along first... behind the bag! It gets through Buckner! Here comes Knight, and the Mets win it!"<BR/><BR/>But even better was the impact on cinema. A bit over a decade later, in Rounders, Matt Damon uttered one of my favorite lines ever as he returned to KGB's place to settle his debt over a game of poker:<BR/><BR/>"I felt like Buckner walking back into Shea."<BR/><BR/>Ah, baseball. What a great game. As George Will noted when the Blue Jays won their World Series: It's an American game being played in Canada and a lot of the players are from Latin America. Except he said it more elegantly than that.JedReporthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15211551122456542965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-70470068141477278582007-07-12T06:11:00.000-07:002007-07-12T06:11:00.000-07:00A slight quibble about first base not being an imp...A slight quibble about first base not being an important defensive position. Maybe I'm prejudiced because I grew up watching the great Gil Hodges. I can say confidently that his skill defending the first base line, going into the hole between first and second, turning the first to second to first double play and fielding erratic throws from short and third made a difference of at least five, maybe ten games in the win column for those fabulous fifties Dodger teams.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-23703090651801341822007-07-12T01:12:00.000-07:002007-07-12T01:12:00.000-07:00By the way, a reader suggests that integration of ...By the way, a reader suggests that integration of baseball in 1947 impelled white players who would have otherwise played right field or first base to third base, which is why we start getting slugging third basemen after WWII. The big flood of fast blacks into the outfield and huge blacks to first base persuaded a bunch of white guys that they better got take extra fielding practice so they can play third base.Steve Sailerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11920109042402850214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-52063166734837095672007-07-12T01:10:00.000-07:002007-07-12T01:10:00.000-07:00I think it's more common to dump problem players a...I think it's more common to dump problem players and head cases in left field and at first base (or DH in the American League) than in right. Dick Allen, for instance, moved from third to the outfield to first. On the other hand, you don't put a slacker in center, the position requiring the most running. And that's the blackest position.Steve Sailerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11920109042402850214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-18584740529142837382007-07-11T23:45:00.000-07:002007-07-11T23:45:00.000-07:00Is the point of this article that blacks are encou...Is the point of this article that blacks are encouraged into the outfield and first base not because of nefarious stereotyping but because of benevolent stereotyping; that is, the belief in their superior speed? Is the point that there could be no reason for nefarious stereotyping? But, what if black players display, on average, more nefarious qualities. Won’t such qualities have an effect on team morale and wins and losses? Why should we not expect a savvy manager to stick a problem player out in the outfield somewhere where he can do the least harm? For example, if anyone has ever had Gary Sheffield on their team, they know that, in spite of his ability to sometimes put up gaudy numbers, he is always a threat to scuttle a team with his lackadaisical play and poor attitude. It is no accident, then, that teams place him out in right field where he can brood alone and where his dropped balls and overthrows cause the least damage. He isn’t there because somehow he’s the perfect specimen of a right fielder. I guess the question is: even if he could somehow occupy the body of Roy Campanella, would you want a Gary Sheffield doing your team’s catching?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-12389147567783692282007-07-11T21:26:00.000-07:002007-07-11T21:26:00.000-07:00Out of curiosity I read the first three paragraphs...Out of curiosity I read the first three paragraphs of Lisa Doris Alexander's philosophical dissertation. <BR/><BR/>Ms Alexander is certainly a glutton for mental self punishment. <BR/><BR/>Her dissertation reveals a rich vein of current feminist emotional abstractions readily available for psychological analysis, but we can leave that to a future generation.<BR/><BR/>Guys, please be kind to your daughters ...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-8814584692969867022007-07-11T17:27:00.000-07:002007-07-11T17:27:00.000-07:00You know Pakistani has an obsession with cricket t...You know Pakistani has an obsession with cricket that might prepare their players to be good at baseball as well. Classifying them as Caucasians seems to be too all-encompasing. <BR/><BR/>Asian, btw, is supposed to be genetically linked to American Indian so what you say about South American ball players can probably be generalized to them - assuming similar physical characteristics, brain organization, etc.<BR/><BR/>There are so many different ways to categorize...Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15416768654321401826noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-74854155526533720122007-07-11T09:50:00.000-07:002007-07-11T09:50:00.000-07:00The racism charge was certainly true through the 6...The racism charge was certainly true through the 60s. But to say that the reason blacks are mainly in the outfield in the 90s and today is because of racism is laughable. If that were the case, sabermatricians would notice and more importantly so would GMs. They would scoop up underutilized backup black outfielders and move them to shortstop or catcher. <BR/>This is the same counter-thought experiment to women getting paid less for the same work. If that were true, then a firm should only hire women and it would automatically boost its profits. Soon, other firms would follow and men would be unemployed, or take a pay cut. In such a scrutinized free market as contemporary baseball, there is no way that stereotyping is causing GMs to waste talent.Antioco Dascalonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10617669156986603638noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-64855958134498683032007-07-11T09:16:00.000-07:002007-07-11T09:16:00.000-07:00Steve -- don't know where you'd find these stats, ...Steve -- don't know where you'd find these stats, but it would be useful to look at salaries over time for each position, particularly relative to each other.<BR/><BR/>If for example, SS was about 75% average of Centerfield, for a time period, say 1980-90, well you'd know that teams themselves felt Centerfield was a more critical position.<BR/><BR/>Then look at who plays what by ethnicity for that time period. It might be interesting.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-90384522173683790762007-07-11T08:24:00.000-07:002007-07-11T08:24:00.000-07:00your system makes no sense and the results should ...your system makes no sense and the results should be thrown out, just like any any other system that has confounding variables.<BR/><BR/>i'm going to start ignoring anything you write about "hispanics" or "latinos". it's all irrelevant and makes no sense, and has no bearing on reality.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-37566420749559027882007-07-11T06:14:00.000-07:002007-07-11T06:14:00.000-07:00The way you've handled the Spanish-surnamed makes ...The way you've handled the Spanish-surnamed makes your mini-study more about culture than about inherent racial abilities (if they actually exist). <BR/><BR/>The more interesting study would be to compare Dominicans-- who come of age pretty much surrounded by others of mostly African descent-- with U.S. blacks.<BR/><BR/>Another study that might be interesting would be to compare the fist black players to hit the major leagues, those who actually played in the Negro Leagues, with black players today. There's probably not a significant sample size, but it might point to a change over time.<BR/><BR/>If you look at this wisely enough, I think you'll probably find that cultural, not physical, features are more important.<BR/><BR/>By the way, the first Asian players to venture across the Pacific were mostly pitchers, but we're seeing Asians more widely scattered around the field now.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com