tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post6882678914035139547..comments2024-03-27T18:24:19.683-07:00Comments on Steve Sailer: iSteve: Is college too easy?Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger88125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-75845427609355243452012-03-06T02:09:27.474-08:002012-03-06T02:09:27.474-08:00Depends on the major. I reckon majors like Mathema...Depends on the major. I reckon majors like Mathematics, Chemical Engineering aren't easy at all. Also depends on the college; I doubt that students have it easy at UCLA or any of the UC schools.Trident Online Universitieshttp://www.trident.edunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-87866248989551642282011-06-08T20:50:08.825-07:002011-06-08T20:50:08.825-07:00"Is college too easy?"
Given that Patri..."Is college too easy?"<br /><br />Given that Patrick Kennedy graduated from one, I'd have to say yes.Mr. Anonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-42079283872012416302011-06-05T14:10:50.605-07:002011-06-05T14:10:50.605-07:00@ Gordon Gekko:
I'm with ya' - good obser...@ Gordon Gekko:<br /><br />I'm with ya' - good observations regarding Chinamen vs. Hindoos. It's the Germans vs. the Ashkenazis, Asian style. Without the whole crypsis bit.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-13062444945981760822011-06-04T18:00:15.439-07:002011-06-04T18:00:15.439-07:00That being said, I am sure palefaces of all ages a...<i>That being said, I am sure palefaces of all ages are just bursting with Michelangelo-quality creativity. Is that why America is trapped in an endless spiral of economic stagnation and deflation? So much for the vaunted white creativity.</i><br /><br />All ages? Strawman argument.<br /><br />America isnt being run by Americans, that doesnt help at all.<br /><br />Finally, the old, old question. If white America is so worthless why is it you asian guys want to come here, why is it you cant work your magic back home?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-33311662226405317372011-06-04T15:09:58.004-07:002011-06-04T15:09:58.004-07:00"Less rigor"?
The LA Times itself has ..."Less rigor"? <br /><br />The LA Times itself has demanded less and less rigor from its writers and readers over the years (PC groupthink).<br /><br />... so what's the problem with colleges doing the same? <br /><br />In a statist society all that matters is ideological purity and not intellectual "rigor".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-79983552649854591172011-06-04T11:44:56.425-07:002011-06-04T11:44:56.425-07:00This reflects risk aversion. I imagine the big mon...<i>This reflects risk aversion. I imagine the big money makers ARE the more extroverted Indian immigrants. Their natural curiosity and verbal skills prevent most of them from being merely money hungry though.</i><br /><br />There is some truth to this from my observations - especially the higher verbal fluency. But Indians do not seem to be at all interested in high culture and materially poor careers like classical musicians the way NE Asians do. I've also encountered more self-impoverishing whacky leftist NE Asian lawyers, academics, etc and virtually zero such Indians.<br /><br />Also, I get the distinct impression that NE Asians concentrate and do better at more intellectual pursuits like elite math and science competitions. Indians also outperform in these (not to the same degree, esp internationally), but also like mundane route memory contests like spelling bees and scrabble competitions which NE Asians seem to avoid.<br /><br />Another interesting point of comparison is that NE Asians seem to be far more athletic yet Indians seem far more sexualized.<br /><br />It would be interesting to see some hard stats compliled on this.Gordon Gekkonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-16096307087531809892011-06-04T05:03:33.531-07:002011-06-04T05:03:33.531-07:00"A higher percentage of very smart and driven..."A higher percentage of very smart and driven Asians voluntarily choose poorer paying careers if they come with intellectual or cultural status."<br /><br />- How about "Slurpee clerk" or "NY Taxi Driver", because those are pretty common, and I don't think many Maharashtrian mothers are going to be bragging to all the neighbors about their son with a title like that.Gabriel Knoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-32288823715260525702011-06-03T23:28:35.101-07:002011-06-03T23:28:35.101-07:00"A higher percentage of very smart and driven..."A higher percentage of very smart and driven Asians voluntarily choose poorer paying careers if they come with intellectual or cultural status."<br /><br />This reflects risk aversion. I imagine the big money makers ARE the more extroverted Indian immigrants. Their natural curiosity and verbal skills prevent most of them from being merely money hungry though.glib, facile n snarkynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-68864355057366958472011-06-03T20:48:43.159-07:002011-06-03T20:48:43.159-07:00Consider that since wealth and status are one and ...<i>Consider that since wealth and status are one and the same to <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSNnuiT0qek" rel="nofollow">you people</a> (Asians) and learning for the sake of learning not high priority,</i><br /><br />That's an exaggerated stereotype. Asians are very much like Jews valuing both material success and education. To split hairs, SE Asian Indians fit this stereotype more than NE Asians, and both are driven by 1st/2nd generation need to materially establish themselves.<br /><br />A higher percentage of very smart and driven Asians voluntarily choose poorer paying careers if they come with intellectual or cultural status. Check out how many Asians make up STEM faculty and staff vs the big money in industry. See what percentage of symphonies, a dying art form, have NE Asian musicians. The normalized percentage of Asians in these cultural and intellectual is much higher than for gentile whites.Gordon Gekkonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-54966164275881110642011-06-03T19:42:36.128-07:002011-06-03T19:42:36.128-07:00"Most are subject to low quality or work ethi..."Most are subject to low quality or work ethic student and/or professor/TAs as well as overall PC-nonsense that avoids hurtful (meaningful) critique and rewards blathering suitable for many nonsense topics."<br /><br />You wouldn't believe the two upper level writing courses I took trying to compensate for the mistake of testing out of freshman English. One was a rhetoric course requiring iconoclastic commentary on the status quo in America. I remember the teacher, who had a degree in art rather than English, mumbling something about food banks being sinister. ????????? The next was an expository writing course in which we wrote autobiographies of our lives up to that point. As I began to think a teaching certificate might be in order, I made a last ditch effort to take a journalism course at a community college (to get experience with editing and types of writing more accessible to kids). It was already closed. I did take a course called Modern English Grammar and Usage. Despite the title, it was strictly a linguistic approach that reminded me how to do sentence diagramming but was too descriptive for honing in on usage. <br /><br />I'd consider advocating teacher colleges again just in case the professors would be more likely to attend to the fact that their students will be responsible for distilling the information to younger generations.jb or mz's black hoodienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-12433657917571555022011-06-03T19:19:05.803-07:002011-06-03T19:19:05.803-07:00"Amy Biehl had super high IQ, IQ high enough ..."Amy Biehl had super high IQ, IQ high enough to get in to Stamford without the benefit of Affirmative Action or legacy preferences."<br /><br />The total IQ number doesn't tell you what a person's strengths are. I believe greater gender dimorphism in Caucasians reduce the likelihood that even the daughter of an engineer will be competent in a hard science major. And you haven't provided any information on what Amy's parents do for a living or what their degrees were. <br /><br />I've noticed that Asian females often follow this pattern as well although they'll tend to pursue a less demanding degree in nursing, business or accounting rather than liberal arts. Not to mention, I've known a handful of Asian males who weren't competent in the hard sciences either. <br /><br />Had Amy lived no doubt she could've gone to law school or become a teacher or even gotten whatever science credits she needed, if any, to go on to medical school. You are also forgetting she had any number of opportunities working for the government and in international business because of her interest in Africa. <br /><br />I'm constantly amazed at the gaucheness of Asians who equate the amount of money in their checking account with both status and IQ. Whites don't. Being good at accumulating wealth is only one kind of ability. Many of the intellectuals in our society aren't motivated by money nor do they have the time apart from their research to gamble in the stock market. Most of them will make a decent salary over a lifetime, pay their taxes and retire comfortably. Just as most of those Asian engineers will live a comfortable middle class lifestyle without becoming super rich. I'm thinking some of what impresses Asians as great wealth is the greater quality of life possible in this country vs the ones they left. <br /><br />Consider that since wealth and status are one and the same to you people and learning for the sake of learning not high priority, you are wasting money getting your degree from an Ivy League U.<br /><br />Get over it. There are many paths to follow for a successful life. White Americans don't need to learn to be like Asians nor do we need to be replaced by a race of people with a tendency toward better computational skills seemingly at the expense of curiosity. There is also absolutely no reason to settle on a life course that makes you miserable.glib, snarky n facilenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-8607849523042882462011-06-03T18:52:24.173-07:002011-06-03T18:52:24.173-07:00Is writing a 5 page pager versus a 20 page paper m...<i>Is writing a 5 page pager versus a 20 page paper more intellectuality challenging or just more of the same, i.e. busy work, where there is a depreciating return on what is actually learned?</i><br /><br />Yes. Writing is an art that you get better with largely through practice like music. Exceptions may be formulaic styles like tech writing that sort is very self limiting and narrow in scope.<br /><br />If a competent professor is really analyzing your paper, giving you appropriate and insightful feedback and you address these issues with each new paper you can be taught to write better. This can only happen in a small seminar format typically found in expensive small lib art colleges. The other 99% of us have to teach ourselves through trail and error, observation and persistence.<br /><br />Even in most lib arts colleges, rarely does this chain of requirements exist or persist. <br />Most are subject to low quality or work ethic student and/or professor/TAs as well as overall PC-nonsense that avoids hurtful (meaningful) critique and rewards blathering suitable for many nonsense topics.Gordon Gekkonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-59033777857399039192011-06-03T18:44:14.880-07:002011-06-03T18:44:14.880-07:00"At the same time, the Northeast Asians in Am..."At the same time, the Northeast Asians in Amy's class at Stamford typically majored in "hard" classes like engineering and science and went off to make real money and pay taxes."<br /><br />Yeah the ones at Yale too. Except for the one that got murdered by the white guy.Truthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17286755693955361308noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-80405775336792495742011-06-03T18:39:57.060-07:002011-06-03T18:39:57.060-07:00In theory it shouldn't matter what you study o...In theory it shouldn't matter what you study or where - smart and motivated kids ultimately end up teaching themselves more than any class does.<br /><br />In practice, humans tend to become complacent herd animals, especially when not challenged to their abilities or forced to think rigourously and independently.<br /><br />Thus, a STEM grad from a decent institution whose had to hustle against the hypercompetitive cream of billions of American and internationalized students graduates with sharpened intellect, discipline and independence. If they don't lack easily-detectable interpersonal communication skills, they are extremely valuable in the workforce.<br /><br />Bright HS kids later graduating from with a typical liberal arts major (with increasingly rare exceptions like philosophy), have learned bad work habits, are overly confident and opininated having never been challenged by professors, peers or subject matter. Worse yet, they are indoctrinated with anti-reality anti-value creating PC nonsense (eg vitimology) that make them less able to understand, adopt, and contribute in society.<br /><br />Certainly, taking two equally talented olympic hopefuls and training one in Colorado Springs while the other at some local high school will produce vastly different results after 4-5yrs.<br />It would be impossible that most bright liberal arts grads wouldn't similarly suffer weakened intellect of their faded raw intellect, as well as have less capacity for hard and sustained work.<br /><br />The intense internationally competitive nature of STEM fields today automatically filters out the dumb, lazy and cunning since they would never be able or willing to work so hard and push themselves. <br /><br />Three obvious clues: <br /><br />(1) students fail out of STEM fields into the liberal arts, not the reverse. <br />(2) the brightest and most motivated of the billions coming to US universities from Asia, India and Europe come for STEM degrees - lib arts degrees are generally looked down upon and not worth the expense and opportunity cost<br />(3) At least at my elite STEM college, our STEM college had the highest GPA for courses taken out of the department (primarily lib arts). I'd be surprised if this wasn't a general rule as Verbal IQ correlates with Non-Verbal IQ more than most lib art majors wish was true.Gordon Gekkonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-52985304807572878422011-06-03T18:17:30.250-07:002011-06-03T18:17:30.250-07:00Steve Hsu wrote a paper a while ago analyzing GPA ...Steve Hsu wrote a paper a while ago analyzing GPA and SAT data by major at his (big public) university. He found that in the humanities and social sciences students could earn very high GPAs with low SATs, whereas this almost never happened in physics and pure math, and less so in chemistry and biology.<br /><br />I think he also had a blog post where he showed the range of asian IQs (standard deviation) was as large or larger than in the white population.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-21910849232456618252011-06-03T16:09:57.786-07:002011-06-03T16:09:57.786-07:00Is writing a 5 page pager versus a 20 page paper m...Is writing a 5 page pager versus a 20 page paper more intellectuality challenging or just more of the same, i.e. busy work, where there is a depreciating return on what is actually learned?<br /><br />Now that I think about it, there is a depreciating return on college after 2 years. I hardly remember anything I learned from undergrad.Shawnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-68483876962124156352011-06-03T15:35:28.581-07:002011-06-03T15:35:28.581-07:00"Is college too easy?"
Perhaps it is th..."Is college too easy?"<br /><br />Perhaps it is the parents that determine whether college is easy or not easy. <br /><br />Amy Biehl had super high IQ, IQ high enough to get in to Stamford without the benefit of Affirmative Action or legacy preferences. <br /><br />Amy's family defined "status" in a certain way - she pursued a course of studies that made college "easy" and then used what she learned to go to Africa where she was murdered. <br /><br />At the same time, the Northeast Asians in Amy's class at Stamford typically majored in "hard" classes like engineering and science and went off to make real money and pay taxes.<br /><br />It is well documented that northeast asian parents tell their children to study subjects that result in them making money, while white parents often tell their children to do "what makes them happy"Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-27774188699109117882011-06-03T15:02:05.316-07:002011-06-03T15:02:05.316-07:00I'll say the Wyeth who did the Helga paintings...<i>I'll say the Wyeth who did the Helga paintings.</i><br />nope his father NC wyeth (who did the famous book illustrations like treasure island, in fact kept him out of school altogether for a time.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-39465671871521164272011-06-03T14:48:17.919-07:002011-06-03T14:48:17.919-07:00"I would argue that the super high IQ kids th..."I would argue that the super high IQ kids that choose to get on the "cool & trendy" track make it easy and the super high IQ kids that study engineering and science make it hard."<br /><br />On the contrary, these kids are doing what is easier for them that just happens to be marketable right now. I've known at least one Caucasian with an engineering major who found the lower level liberal arts courses he was required to take very difficult. I suspect this is true for most Asians as well. If engineering types would recognize their place, that we only have room for a finite number of them, it wouldn't be such a bad proposition to import a few now and then.jb or mz's black hoodienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-36892786399974545222011-06-03T14:39:04.873-07:002011-06-03T14:39:04.873-07:00"So my point is that a high IQ gentile born i..."So my point is that a high IQ gentile born in America will go to college and select relatively easy courses and just not learn a lot and not contribute a lot to our nation while on the other hand a high IQ person of Korean ancestry will select the major that will make him or her the most money on average which means hard majors that really contribute to the success of our nation."<br /><br />What does an Asian business, nursing or engineering student know that a Caucasian liberal arts major doesn't? You are speaking in terms of a broad knowledge base vs more focused, often technical knowledge. The Western tradition in education started with this all encompassing approach to learning. The more limited, technical learning was relegated to an inferior position until the modern era, coinciding with the Soviet focus on engineering degrees and the Cold War. A change in preference for engineering and science degrees has not at all reduced the need for pundits with training in these fields to have the broad knowledge base of a liberal arts major to draw upon when interfacing with the public. It's the difference between learning a lot about one subject and learning much about many that you are describing. We Westerners don't consider a person truly erudite unless they demonstrate an affection for the latter type of learning that just happens to be combined with an obsession with a scientific or technological endeavor. I suspect that Western Civilization will show preference for those who demonstrate this ability to incorporate knowledge from many fields until we cease to exist entirely.glib, facile n snarkynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-2407200738849479032011-06-03T14:22:50.629-07:002011-06-03T14:22:50.629-07:00The title of this thread says it all
"Is Co...The title of this thread says it all <br /><br />"Is College Too Easy?"<br /><br />Looking at super high IQ kids in college right now, which of them make it easy on themselves and which make it hard?<br /><br />I would argue that the super high IQ kids that choose to get on the "cool & trendy" track make it easy and the super high IQ kids that study engineering and science make it hard.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-82011824289469824342011-06-03T14:06:57.789-07:002011-06-03T14:06:57.789-07:00"And that, should give you some idea how I wa..."And that, should give you some idea how I was 'educated' (trick question name me a great 19th or 20th century realist artist with a college degree."<br /><br />OK. I'll bite on this one anyway. Since I can only remember this one, I'll say the Wyeth who did the Helga paintings.glib, facile n snarkynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-84581986566743497872011-06-03T13:52:57.417-07:002011-06-03T13:52:57.417-07:00The Korean super genius is mistaken that the impor...The Korean super genius is mistaken that the importation of dummies is good for him selfishly. If it is, then why doesn't he move to a poor province of India? Or, to Harlem in the USA? In either place, he would be in paradise, by his lights: surrounded by dummies, in a dummy society, with a dummy culture, where no one can compete with him. Good luck getting an efficient sewer service or police force, though.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-76811273526141040742011-06-03T13:45:07.051-07:002011-06-03T13:45:07.051-07:00"Instead, he devoted his intellect almost exc..."Instead, he devoted his intellect almost exclusively to the collection of streetcar transfers, and to the study of the history of his native Boston. He worked hard at becoming a normal human being, but never entirely succeeded. He found the concept of beauty, for example, to be completely incomprehensible, and the idea of sex repelled him. At fifteen he took a vow of celibacy, which he apparently kept for the remainder of his life, dying a virgin at the age of 46."<br /><br />from an article on extremely high IQ posted on The Prometheus Society website<br /><br />The poster suggesting that only 150+ IQ Asians are making money in this country is a self-promoting bag of wind. Your IQ obviously falls well below what any college educated person would consider extremely high. Plus, as an East Asian (90-120 cluster probably due to extreme inbreeding), the probability is even lower that you are in this range. <br /><br />There are lots of bright people who make money and build businesses. The Walton family, for instance, who aren't particularly known for being geniuses. Then there's the film industry with its motley assortment of wealthy beneficiaries of the public's insatiable desire for entertainment. Similarly, there are the numerous fast food empires with success driven by the insatiable appetite people have for hamburgers and pizza, also not known for having been created by high IQ nerds. <br /><br />Furthermore, why isn't South Korea drawing a huge amount of investment along with lower IQ immigrants clamoring to get in to take those jobs too easy for extremely high IQ Koreans to do? The last I heard was that instead of teeming with capitalist urges, South Koreans were devolving into socialist drones who weren't particularly fond of Americans. <br /><br />Yes, while you can say anything here on iSteve, what you say doesn't necessarily mean anything. <br /><br />Oh, and for the art institute grad, so what?glib, facile n snarkynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9430835.post-89688485654933416912011-06-03T13:44:16.696-07:002011-06-03T13:44:16.696-07:00http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dusY1knjBBs
good l...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dusY1knjBBs<br /><br />good lord!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com