Hitting 50 has become the thing to do for high school kickers
So many more high school players are able to kick field goals from that distance, as special teams continue to have a major impact on games.
Eric Sondheimer
There was a time when field goals beyond 50 yards in high school football were rare. Now, with so many ex-soccer players receiving lessons from private coaches, long field goals are as much a part of the game as 100-yard rushing performances. ...
What ties many of the kickers together is that they receive lessons from a growing number of competent private coaches. Castellanos, based in Fontana, has been giving free lessons for years. Others charge a fee, such as ex-kickers Chris Sailer and Paul Stonehouse. But they are producing results.
Chris Sailer (no readily apparent relation to me) was 18 years behind me at Notre Dame high school of Sherman Oaks, CA. He's the only kicker ever to be the San Fernando Valley football player of the year, after kicking eleven field goals in four playoff games, including a last play, game-winning 58-yarder in the rain.
And there are even private instructors for long snappers, such as San Fernando Valley-based Chris Rubio. ...
The kicker who has beaten USC the last two seasons on game-ending field goals, Erik Folk of Washington, went to Notre Dame, is a protege of Sailer and is the younger brother of New York Jets kicker Nick Folk. USC Coach Lane Kiffin called two timeouts trying to ice Folk. He only smiled, because the private coaches prepare their kickers for just such a situation.
That's one reason every single NFL kicker last season was a non-Hispanic white.
By the way, I think the NFL should narrow the goals post to make kicking a field goal more of an accomplishment, like it used to be before kickers became so competent. Forty years ago, it was a huge national sports story when old George Blanda would come on the field on the last play and kick a 35 yard field goal to win the game. Now, unless it's snowing, it's only a big story if the poor bastard misses. (It's become almost as bad as it is for centers, who only get noticed for bad snaps.)
By the way, I think the NFL should narrow the goals post to make kicking a field goal more of an accomplishment, like it used to be before kickers became so competent. Forty years ago, it was a huge national sports story when old George Blanda would come on the field on the last play and kick a 35 yard field goal to win the game. Now, unless it's snowing, it's only a big story if the poor bastard misses. (It's become almost as bad as it is for centers, who only get noticed for bad snaps.)
I'm always surprised kickers haven't developed the leg to get it deep in to the end zone on kickoffs- David Buehler of Dallas is pretty good btw. That would be a great specialty bc it would avoid having to deal with the Leon Washington's and Dexter McCluster's of the world. If they are available, I'm surprised coaches don't think that skill is worthy of a roster spot.
ReplyDeleteDan in Dc
Steve, 18 years after you, same last name, same high school, same kicking pedigree.....
ReplyDeleteTHAT IS YOUR SON!!!!
Dan in DC
PS- Garo Yepremian kicked in two games for Jacksonville last year
FYI. Here is an Alice in Wonderland article by Princeton professors about the role of minorities in precipitating the economic crisis.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.princeton.edu/main/news/archive/S28/61/99Q04/index.xml?section=topstories
The authors are apparently arguing that minority subprime borrowing was due to institutional racism.
It's notable because in his book American Apartheid, the same Princeton author Douglas Massey was claiming banks were not giving enough credit to minorities.
dan sepulveda, the steelers punter, might be mestizo. otherwise it's the same for punters. they're a lot better now and they kick it so far. so much further than they did 20 years ago.
ReplyDeletei'm sure everything about kicking and punting is better now with respect to training, and the pay is much higher now, with every guy earning between half a million and a million per season. but i'm just as confident that an equally big factor is that good athletes are deliberately moved from other positions to kicker and punter because they were the "wrong" race to play linebacker or whatever. sepulveda was moved from linebacker. i can't think of a single african player that was deliberately moved to punter or kicker. the opposite is normal though, they're often moved to positions which they aren't really suited for because of their unlimited "potential" and "upside", qualities which other players are never, never said to have.
this year, the cowboys staff had to shut down foot races in training camp, because a few of the players had injured themselves trying to beat kicker david buehler in friendly short sprint races. he's faster in a short sprint than any other player on the cowboys, and should have been playing linebacker or tight end or fullback since NCAA football. this shows when he kicks field goals, as he doesn't have the years of practice he needs, and sometimes misses easy ones. meanwhile he lead the league in touchbacks on kickoffs, because he has the strongest leg, and he probably leads the league in tackles for a kicker. he already had a 2 tackle game this year.
Interesting. So whites are workaholic grind outs in athletics. I guess to each his own.
ReplyDeleteHas anyone ever done a DNA analysis of Hispanics named 'Rubio' versus all the rest?
ReplyDeleteSteve, no one gives a fuck about a sport that has interruptions every two minutes and where you need to be a 360 lbs juiced gorilla with no agility and endurance to compete. Why don't you write about a REAL sport for a change, like soccer? The last time I checked, being an athlete was about being athletic and not a 360 lbs powerlifter with 25% bodyfat who gets windedd if he has to exert effort for more than two minutes.
ReplyDelete"but i'm just as confident that an equally big factor is that good athletes are deliberately moved from other positions to kicker and punter because they were the "wrong" race to play linebacker or whatever."
ReplyDeleteSailer writes an article about how specialized kicking is becoming, and people are hiring kicking coaches for their very young kids, and you go off on your same old talented rant about how Brian Urlachers in high schools all across America are being "forced" to play kicker.
"a few of the players had injured themselves trying to beat kicker david buehler in friendly short sprint races. he's faster in a short sprint than any other player on the cowboys,"
No, he defeated ONE player DeAngelo Smith, a 5th round, journeyman safety in a race. Bueheler's combine 40 yard dash times were 4.56 and 4.63. Fast, but nothing out of the ordinary.
"and should have been playing linebacker or tight end or fullback since NCAA football."
Yep, no white guys playing those positions. Actually, he should be playing one of those positions in the NFL because his kicking SUCKS.
"and he probably leads the league in tackles for a kicker."
If 6 whole tackles in 19 games leads to that distinction, you would be correct.
Dude, would you learn how to read for Christ sakes.
Good WSJ piece on the Jets' long-snapper last week here (subscription required, I imagine):
ReplyDeletehttp://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704116004575522321964011564.html?KEYWORDS=jets+long+snapper
It's just as Steve Sailer says: all the hard work is about not being noticed when you screw up.
@Anon
ReplyDeleteThis is absolutely true. So many white parents make sure that their kids are dedicated to sports. I definitely think that the workaholic white athlete is an accurate stereotype. I don't think its the case that whites or East Asians are necessarily more or less conscientious relative to one another. It's more a function of the two groups having different interests, i.e. whites are more interested in sports, East Asians more interested in academic pursuits, etc.
"Steve, no one gives a fuck about a sport that has interruptions every two minutes and where you need to be a 360 lbs juiced gorilla with no agility and endurance to compete. Why don't you write about a REAL sport for a change, like soccer? The last time I checked, being an athlete was about being athletic and not a 360 lbs powerlifter with 25% bodyfat who gets windedd if he has to exert effort for more than two minutes."
ReplyDeletePlease, stop. This is Steve's blog, and he can write about whatever he wants, even sports like gridiron football. Also, where have you been? Steve inflicts his ill-informed opinions about soccer (a sport he does not like or understand, but feels obligted to talk about anyway) on us every four years during the World Cup (as he did a few months ago). Trust me, you don't want to encourage Steve to write more about soccer. Be happy he doesn't, for the most part, write about soccer.
Since we're talking about kickers in gridiron and the influence of soccer on kickers, one should also note the recent influx of aussie rules players into the punting position. Just as soccer style kickers changed the kicking game, so too aussie rules players are changing the punting game. Gridiron is getting some influence from other football codes where kicking the ball is still the center of what the game of foot-ball should be all about: kicking the ball with the foot.
Forty years ago a 35 yd field goal in pro football was rare and now high schoolers can kick +50 yard ones.
ReplyDeleteBoy those kicking genes can mutate awful quickly.
An idea:
ReplyDeleteAs Steve suggested, narrow the goal posts (by perhaps as much as a third), and raise the crossbar about five feet, but make a field goal count for four, not three points.
This would aid passing teams that have a hard time punching it in from the red zone. 2 field goals would be > one touchdown & PAT. 8>7. It would also make effective field-goal kickers an even more precious commodity.
Tennessee beat Alabama-Birmingham last week because UAB's kicker missed five field goals in the close loss. There is no truth to the rumor that Tennessee's players carried UAB's kicker off the field on their shoulders.
All kidding aside, the kickers are really, really good. Its much harder than it looks.
----------------------------------
For the European in the thread who hates American Football because of all the "360 lb. men" with "25% bodyfat": Thats what seperate countries and cultures are all about. We dont play polo (much) here either, but Im delighted that the Argentinians enjoy that game, and that the Canadians love hockey, and that the Japanese love sumo. Real diversity is interesting, but a global-corporate uni-culture with a global-corporate uni-sport is not so interesting. If a race of aliens stopped their spaceship next to a big-time college football game, they'd probably think we were a fun bunch.
Roll Tide.
Steve,
ReplyDeleteI know you don't have cable, so let me tell you something that just happened on Monday Night Football that you might have found interesting.
Apparently, the Patriots have a white halfback. The commentators raved about how his pluckiness in being an under-sized back from a division 2 school, etc. They spent about five minutes trying to point out how unique it was that "a guy like that" would be an RB all the while tap dancing around his race.
So, the smartest NFL brain trust thinks this guy is NFL worthy, but he couldn't get a Division 1 scholarship?
ReplyDeleteYes, at least a couple of Aussie Rules players have punted in the NFL. I think the idea is to play in Australia in your 20s, then, as you slow down and can't do that crazy jumping they do in Australia as good anymore, become a punter in the NFL in your 30s.
ReplyDeleteI'm surprised that the arms race has not escalated on the otherside. Can't we bring in a tall, long-limbed high jumping freak wearing the lightest gear specifically to block kicks? If they would have allowed midget tossing to block, I'd be watching Monday night football right now. (I mean, I like football, but I just watched two days of it and it's early in the season)
ReplyDeleteqaz
Another way to make it harder, would be to make the snap be at a fixed time, rather than at-will. This would allow for defenses to time their assault (running start) which would be awesome and allow for more blocks.
ReplyDeleteqaz
There is also an increasing number of Australian Rules Football players coming to the US after their playing days are over to play punter in the NFL. These guys have brought their style of "punting" to American football and apparently it leads to much better hang times, which is really what NFL coaches want from their punters anyway. Big hang time makes it very difficult for even the fleetest of returners to bring back punts.
ReplyDeleteRegarding kickers hitting kick-offs deep into end zones, they were doing it a lot until the mid-1990's, but the NFL lowered the tee height by two-thirds and pushed the kickers back and additional five yards I believe. This was done because over half of all kick-offs were not being returned league-wide. This rule change combined with the death of the NFL career special teamer has lead to a huge increase in special teams TD's over the last decade and a half.
Getting rid of hash marks, or at least widening them would also make field goals more of an accomplishment.
ReplyDeleteIf you had to kick from where the ball went down you would have some real tough corner shots, the way it is in rugby, and if I remember correctly the way it used to be in football (I am old enough to remember players running into the center of the end zone after scoring the touchdown in order to give their team a better chance at the point after attempt).
Anonymous in Tokyo
"By the way, I think the NFL should narrow the goals post to make kicking a field goal more of an accomplishment, like it used to be before kickers became so competent."
ReplyDeleteYeah when you mentioned this topic a few months ago I thought to myself: now THERE'S an internship oppr. Have a couple/few college kids watch game films of the last 4 or 5 seasons. Record where every field goal was kicked in relation to dead center. The result is probably (though doesn't have to be) something approximating a normal distribution with the median at dead center of the field. With that data, the NFL could set the field goal posts to whatever width they want to get whatever success rate they want.
Watching all the game film and recording the field goal attempts could probably done in software as well. That too might be an interesting internship oppr for the MIT & Caltech kids.
"So, the smartest NFL brain trust thinks this guy is NFL worthy, but he couldn't get a Division 1 scholarship?"
ReplyDeleteHappens all the time. Judging talent is difficult, and people mature a lot in 4-5 years. Look at the occasional Ivy or even Div III player that makes it to the NFL.
When evaluating athletic talent you have to renormalize the white guys down. If a white guy runs well at the combine, it's almost always because he's been obsessively training his start, drive phase mechanics, stride length, etc. (Or living in the weight room and doing goofy Olympic lifts and plyometrics.)
ReplyDeleteThose guys are just overly obsessed with making it and they know how to game the system. How many stiff white guys have run a 4.5 at the combine but they couldn't change direction and make a move if their life depended on it? Most NFL scouts aren't fooled, though. They know the score.
"Those guys are just overly obsessed with making it and they know how to game the system. How many stiff white guys have run a 4.5 at the combine but they couldn't change direction and make a move if their life depended on it? Most NFL scouts aren't fooled, though. They know the score."
ReplyDeleteI doubt the Patriots RB was hired for his forty time. And as for stiff white guys trying to game the system, what about black guys full of athletic talent who flame out due to poor attitudes, poor impulse control, or lack of coachability?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danny_Woodhead
ReplyDeleteThe Patriots RB other commenters are mentioning is named Danny Woodhead. He's a bittersweet story for Cornhusker fans like myself. Nebraskans, particularly those in the western part of the state, are thrilled to see him succeed in the NFL, but were sorely disappointed he never got a scholarship offer from the Big Red Machine.
The MNF announcers had plausible deniability for dancing around Woodhead's race, because his diminutive height, only 5'7", permitted them to speak of his "unique" physical attributes.
However, Nebraska's current backfield is of some interest to the HBD crowd. Nebraska's starting RB, Rex Burkhead, is a white kid from the DFW area. He came to Nebraska because UT-Austin would only recruit him as a linebacker. Nebraska's starting QB, Taylor Martinez, is a latino kid from Corona, CA. Steve Sarkisian, then an assistant at USC recruited Martinez as a safety prospect rather than a QB.
Fred, that white halfback is one of the fastest players on the team. He's a castoff from the arch-rival NY Jets. The Patriots also have the best white receiver, Wes Welker. He's a castoff from the arch-rival Miami Dolphins, where he once kicked a point after and kicked off when the kicker got hurt (Welker was a kicker in high school and hit a 57-yarder, longer that the Pats current kicker's personal best!). Welker's understudy is a white JEWISH kid name Julian Edelman, who filled in without much of a dropoff in production when Welker was hurt last year. The Pats rookie punter is a Romanian of Hungarian descent who speaks 4 languages and already has a masters degree. He cranked a 65-yarder last night.
ReplyDeleteIn other words, Bill Belichick is a true believer that players should be intelligent and versatile, and his success with the Patriots bears his theories out. I call it the Swiss Army Knife School of player evaluation.
To the Soccer anon, all I can say is, as a former 2-way (offensive guard and nose tackle on defense)football player in high school, that the game is far different on the field than you can understand from watching on TV. The guys you see on television are not only off the charts in strength, but their quickness and agility FOR THEIR SIZE is also world class, to say nothing of their tolerance of pain. You're too used to watching quick and agile peewees running around the pitch to appreciate the quickness and footwork involved in football line play. Lineman are, as Dan Jenkins calls them, elephants on roller skates.
Brutus
When evaluating athletic talent you have to renormalize the white guys down. If a white guy runs well at the combine, it's almost always because he's been obsessively training his start, drive phase mechanics, stride length, etc. (Or living in the weight room and doing goofy Olympic lifts and plyometrics.)
ReplyDeleteThat's pretty much Joe DeFranco's gig - training athletes how to perform well at the combine.
Eric Cressey does a similar thing for baseball players.
Roll Tide to the anonymous Bama fan on here, glad to know I am not alone!!
ReplyDeleteThis has been a special last two weeks for kickers.
ReplyDeleteBoth Garrett Hartley (later cut) and Sebastian Janikowski missed kicks < 35 yards to give their respective teams wins in week 3. Janikowski was a taken in the first round (by the Raiders, but still).
This week, Josh Scobee nailed a 59 yarder at the horn to beat the Colts.
Finally, Stephen Gostkowski had 7 kickoffs last night against the Dolphins...5 went for touchbacks - the furthest the other 2 were run out was the 21 yard line.
The Chargers had an Aussie rules punter for several years, Darren Bennett. Good punter, great tackler.
So many more high school players are able to kick field goals from that distance, as special teams continue to have a major impact on games
ReplyDeleteYou realize that sentence is a non-sequitur, right? Grammatically, not to say topically, the second clause should read something like, "as improvements in nutrition ..." or "as performance gains similar to those in golf also show up in other sports," or "as more football kids come from a soccer background." After all, special teams play itself has been crucial in high school football for at least 20 yrs.
Blanda's big-deal kicks were all 40+ (at least one of them 52 in 1970), not 35 yards.
ReplyDeleteI'm starting to notice more Mexican-American star quarterbacks at the high school level in SoCal versus just a decade ago when Mark Sanchez was about the only one.
ReplyDeleteAnon,
ReplyDeleteInteresting about Welker's understudy.
Re the punter: the WSJ had a story about him in August, I think. Steve might find it interesting to look it up. The punter's immigrant parents were dumbfounded that their son could get a full scholarship for punting a football.
Re Woodhead's height: 5'7" isn't extraordinarily short for an RB. A lot of greats have been in the 5'8"-5'9" range, and some standouts have been shorter.
Re soccer versus football and linemen: Some of the linemen today are sort of ridiculous looking. If they all had to play both ways, as in high school, you'd see more agile and fit linemen as a rule. As Steve pointed out in his World Cup coverage, the endurance factor makes soccer more racially diverse, since you need more than sprinting ability alone to play it.
To put it in football terms, think of Steve Tasker, the great special teamer who used to play for Buffalo. He was built like a soccer pro, because he trained for endurance as well as speed and strength (since special teams plays often last longer than regular plays).
Another thing about soccer I've come to appreciate is that it has fewer stoppages for penalties, etc. Taking two minutes to review film to see if a receiver made "a football move" with the ball before he went out of bounds can be tedious.
I'm surprised no one in the thread discussed the emergence of white feature backs this year in the NFL. Peyton Hillis of Cleve, John Kuhn from Green Bay, Woodhead from NE, Gerhart for Minnesota...... unheard of 10 years ago.
ReplyDeleteSteve do a story on it for God's sake!!! We're not paying you good money!!!
I have donated 3x btw
dan in Dc
Specialization is for insects.
ReplyDelete-Robert Heinlein.
"(I am old enough to remember players running into the center of the end zone after scoring the touchdown in order to give their team a better chance at the point after attempt).
ReplyDelete"
Especially interesting because so much of the endzone passing game is the fade to the corner.
Or the end-around run that stretches out at the pylone.
Would introduce an interesting strategic wrinkle if the easier play for the touchdown also made it harder to get the PAT.
____________________________________
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
@Anon
This is absolutely true. [...]
____________________________________
Haha.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdIIPnI8laQ
ReplyDeleteMore from Corona's own, Taylor Martinez last night as he set a school record for rushing yards by a QB. By the way, for one year of high school he was coached by Toby Gerhart's Dad.