You'll certainly be excited Steve if AQ waltzes into control, with the MB (they are basically the same branches of the same Salafist movement). Or if Saudi falls.
Like driving your car much? Not paying $10 or more a gallon? Yep then what happens in the ME matters. That's the cost of those cheap sneakers and Ipods.
Oh, c'mon Steve. Really? It's exciting, and I'm not being sarcastic.
Thousands of people rise up in popular revolt and throw out - or, rather, motivate the Army to throw out - a corrupt and unpopular dictator, and we can watch the whole thing live. How can that not be moving and exciting?
Furthermore, this happens in a populous country with a long, interesting history that in antiquity was central to the development of Western civilization. In modern times, Egypt is a key part of the Arab and Islamic worlds, with which are in perpetual conflict. (It doesn't matter whether the Stevosphere thinks we shouldn't be involved in the Middle East ... in fact, we are, so events there are important, whether you want them to be or not.)
And then there's the whole technological angle of it. Regardless of the role they are ultimately found to have played in the final outcome, "social media" DID play a critical role in getting the revolt started, keeping it going, and maintaining international attention.
Right now, this feels like the revolution that Mark Zuckerberg built. I'm sure that will turn out to be a wild exaggeration, but for the moment, it's a cool concept to think about. How can you not be interested?
"Like driving your car much? Not paying $10 or more a gallon? Yep then what happens in the ME matters. That's the cost of those cheap sneakers and Ipods."
Don't get your shorts in a twist. I was just reading the other day that US oil companies were dramatically increasing the output of domestic oil fields using new techniques in hydraulic fracturing of shale. Our dependence on foreign oil is about to decline 50% in the next 10 years, no thanks to the Obama Administration. Moreover, I read somewhere else that Saudi oil reserves are overstated by as much as 40%. By the time the Mideast situation becomes intractable, it will become East Asia's problem since they are the biggest consumers of Mideast oil.
And you know what, that's just what AQ and the Muslim Brotherhood deserve: ruthless Chinese coming after them -- instead of water boarding, the PLA will revive such wonderful ancient Chinese customs as death by a thousand cuts, which is essentially giving you morphine, then using a knife to slowly strip the flesh from your extremities before snapping them off. Finally, they perform a vivisection and puncture your heart when they get bored -- which can take up to a day. All the while, a gracious man stands patiently at the ready holding a wicker basket to catch the pieces of you as they are removed.
I've said it elsewhere and I'll say it here: this could be either the best thing to happen to the Egyptian birth rate (an increased sense of participation in society = a tendency to reduce fertility, e.g., blacks in South Africa post-apartheid) or the worst (the end of Mubarak's family planning policies, perhaps even the establishment of a pro-natalist Islamist regime like in Iran post 1979, though I find that unlikely.) I think the former is more likely than not, since the fertility decline in Egypt has stalled because the fertility of the middle and upper classes has remained high, and they are the most likely to perceive themselves as benefiting materially from the regime change.
On the other hand, Egypt could continue to chug along at 3 births per woman, hemorrhaging emigrants for decades to come. Poor Italy. :(
Don't get your shorts in a twist. I was just reading the other day that US oil companies were dramatically increasing the output of domestic oil fields using new techniques in hydraulic fracturing of shale. Our dependence on foreign oil is about to decline 50% in the next 10 years, no thanks to the Obama Administration. Moreover, I read somewhere else that Saudi oil reserves are overstated by as much as 40%. By the time the Mideast situation becomes intractable, it will become East Asia's problem since they are the biggest consumers of Mideast oil.
I don't think Whiskey gives a flying $#@% about oil independence. That's just a guess based on how he never talks about it, almost assumes it's impossible, in fact almost hopes it's impossible.
Reportedly it was emphasized (see American Renaissance homepage re an improv meeting held after the cancellation in Charlotte ) in this improv gathering that the relatively low Egyptian IQ might not sustain fledgling democracy. Already, there's more chanting than discourse; and more passion about abstract freedoms than regard to here-and-now economic re-starting.
Eh? Maybe some influence on Minoan Crete, but hardly 'central'.
OK, I exaggerated. Really, it was just central to my primary education in the 1960s, when we were taught about Egypt, Greece and Rome sequentially, although I must admit that only the Greece -> Rome connection was discussed. Egypt was probably in there because it happened in the Med, had a Biblical connection (which of course was never mentioned in our very progressive curriculum, but we all knew about it) and was cool, what with hieroglyphics, pyramids, mummies and the like.
Gotta agree with Whiskey - if the Muslim Brotherhood comes to power in Egypt, then we've got a disaster on our hands.
Hopefully there's a Putin in the Egyptian army [or the in Egyptian intelligence services] who can crack a few heads, and keep that from happening, but, if not, then, well, yikes...
I certainly would not want to be a Copt [or any other Christian] in Egypt right now.
"I was just reading the other day that US oil companies were dramatically increasing the output of domestic oil fields using new techniques in hydraulic fracturing of shale. Our dependence on foreign oil is about to decline 50% in the next 10 years, no thanks to the Obama Administration."
I feel the same, man... I mean, in one way believe the rebellion might fight back against US imperialism - I love America, but you guys should listen to Pat Buchanan, at least in foreign and immigration policy - and lessen the Israeli stronghold on the Middle Eastt. On the other hand, I'm European, I sympathize with European peoples all over the world, and, considering the current state of the world, I've would like to focuse more on them, rather than on Arabs.
I'm mighty drunk, right now, so, I apologize for all the spelling errors in the text. (Not to mention the stylistic fuck-ups, that surely exist.)
How can that [throwing out a dictator] not be moving and exciting?
They threw out a bad guy and guess what? within no time flat they'll be slavering for a worse guy, probably with a towel wound round his head, to dictate every last move they make. Depressing is what it is.
I think Whiskey is right. Egypt is almost uncannily like Afghanistan. Thousands of years of civilization, endless goat herders and mountains, a thin strip of good land in an almost endless dessert, graveyard of empires.... Wait a minute! They aren't alike at all. He's wrongedy wrong wrong!
Svigor, Whiskey doesn't want oil independence. He likes the dependence as a reason for warmongering. I wish he gave investment advice. I could do the opposite and get rich.
This situation is so much like Iran '79 it's spooky.
Egypt 2010 is so different than Iran 1979 it's hard to believe anyone could make such a comparison. Iran had a vibrant Islamic movement with a popular charismatic leader. Iran's revolution was several years in the making. Egypt's revolution was completely spontaneous, disorganized, and took place in about a week. Egypt's Islamic movement (Muslim Brotherhood) is feeble and has been collaborating with the CIA for half a century. They have no leadership or direction. Even during this brief revolution they have been indecisive. The Brotherhood is a bitter enemy of Al Qaeda.
output of domestic oil fields using new techniques in hydraulic fracturing of shale cost more per gallon still, sweetheart, so oil's going to keep going up in price, especially since the fed keeps printing money to keep the deratives invested banks afloat.
As for Egypt, if they balk at israel that could give the neocons a new country du jour to advocate bombing. it would be pretty hard for petty dicators to give up that aid though..
There is widespread speculation that Suleiman or whatever, who is the torturer-in-chief will succeed Mubarak. he'll be a pro israel shrill. CIA backed, I beleive.
1) 1848, thousands of Europeans man barricades against the reaction, fueled by pamphleteers 2) 1917 Lenin arrives at Finland station, gets control, I believe, of a radio station 3) 1956 Maygars mass in Budapest -- only to be shot down 4) 1968 Czech Spring in Prague 5) 1968 Mass student demonstrations throughout Western Europe and the US -- including Chicago Democratic Convention. LBJ declines to continue his reelection bid 6) 1979 Shah is toppled by mass demonstration in Iran 7) 1986 Marcox is toppled by 'people power' in the Filipines 8) 1988 Mass songfests in Talin and Vilnius help lead to crack up of Soviet union 9) 1989 Mass demostrations aginst Chinese Communist Party 10) 2000 B*92 radio in Belgrade helps bring Milosevic down 11) 2003-2006 Various mass, 'color coded' 'revolutions' , some successful, some not
So basically, 160 years of mass demonstartion/revolution. In each people, naturally, used the latest technology, but it hardly seems that any specific technology, let alone facebook, was necessary, sufficient, or really even a critical (rather than 'nice to have, esp. for outsiders) feature.
Our dependence on foreign oil is about to decline 50% in the next 10 years
Whatever. The AP article on this says the Credit Suisse analyst projects that imports could be slashed by 60% by 2020, but that's dependent on expansion of Gulf production and reduction in gasoline demand (everyone's gonna get a Volt, I guess) in addition to the hydrofrac production to come.
The new fields are expected to generate a max of 2 million barrels/day by 2010. This is great news, the best news on the oil front I've read in a while.
But...current domestic production is about 6 million barrels/day. IIRC, decline rates on current domestic fields are maybe 4-5% per year. So in ten years we will lose 2.5 million of the current 6 million bpd. So these new hydrofrac fields may hold us even. Current Gulf production is something like 2 million bpd - I'm not an expert, but I'm not sure you can at least double the Gulf in 10 years, given existing wells tend to decline over time, which you really have to do to cut imports.
That leaves imports, which at 15 million or so bpd, would need to go down to 6 million bpd in this scenario. Just don't see how that's possible - no way in 9 years you can get a large enough portion of the population using unproven, expensive electrics that lack adequate range. If my logic is wrong, I will humbly accept correction.
But please don't construe anything I've said to mean I agree with Whiskey. The Arabs will need to sell us oil if they plan to eat. I hope I live long enough to see the day when we don't need their oil and can tell them to fuck off.
Early days still, Steve. We have to wait and see if the muslim brotherhood (as seems likely) efectively forms the next government. Then it'll be a game changer in the middle-east.What with Hmas beating Israel in Lebanon in 2008 (new tactics), a nuclear armed Iran and the demographic Palestinian explosion - will make for interesting times.I'll lay odds on the state of Israel not existing in 50 years' time - if this does or does not involve WW3 and nuclear weapons, I don't know. If the hispanic/black dominated USA of that time will even get involved is doubtful. And that's just for starters.What about that corrupt and horrible Saudi regime and half the world's oli reserves?
Reportedly...the relatively low Egyptian IQ might not sustain fledgling democracy. Already, there's more chanting than discourse; and more passion about abstract freedoms than regard to here-and-now economic re-starting.
AND...
I'm reminded of an old David Frost joke:
"There's going to be another general election in Greece. And we all know which generals are going to be elected."
Swap Egypt for Greece, and it may not be so far off the mark.
There was an entertaining (well it made me giggle) article in The (London) Times last year from Rod Liddle regarding the Southern European debt crisis, and noting how it wasn't that long ago that all these countries were run by Colonels, Fascists or some other variety of authoritarian regime.
He doesn't join the dots (naturally) but what little numbers I've seen indicate that perhaps the nations of Southern Europe work better that way. I suspect most rail users prefer trains to run on time.
IT is entirely possible that for a variety of reasons, democracy only works for some peoples - and not others.
Or is that crazy racist talk?
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/rod_liddle/article7114008.ece It’s not just the Greeks – beware of all the siesta states
Mainstream media now reports Mubarak is believed to be one of the world's richest men, worth maybe 50 billion dollars. Looks like he was pretty good at squirreling away the "aid" we were giving Egypt. If true then the utter greed of such kleptocrats is really astounding, as if one can't take care of their family and themselves for a mere one billion of stolen money. Information like this just becomes public when it's all over; before that it's all hush-hush. Makes one look around at all our other "allies" for hire and try to guess which one will be the next to go; might make a nice betting game.
The difference between Mubarak and any successor is the difference between Tweedledum and Tweedledee.
It's no use arguing with the idiots who believe otherwise. These idiots have what Mencken called "believing minds." Their starry eyes look for the millennium. In America they are either Republicans in a big box church, or Obama-bumper-sticker types.
As to Amurica's energy dependence upon the Semitic East: just engage in a crash program, WW2-style, to bring a bunch of nuke plants on line. That is a fantasy only because it cannot get that bad. As innumerable realists have pointed out, Tweedledum and Tweedledee have to sell the oil to someone, or they're nothing; nor will they sell it at gouging prices if they know what's good for them. I am there referring to Amurica's other, existing nuclear capacities.
By the way, Amurica gets at least as much of its junk from other sources as it does from the Semitic East - Venezuela, for example. But don't raise this point to the idiots; let them enjoy their TV dramas. So long as their eyes are glued to their screens and their hands are waving green or orange or cedar- or denim-covered flags, they are too occupied to be causing much trouble.
The military wanted the 82 year old Mubarak out and tried to get him to go gracefully, but when he wouldn't do so, this was the result.
It's a fair guess that the military was part and parcel of the social network ousting. If it was not they who instigated it, it was certainly they who orchestrated it once its seed had sprouted.
As the rest of the country was quiet, this was not the popular revolution the Western press imagines, but rather the successful coup by the military.
It can turn out well or badly for both us and the Egyptian people.
Only a system that keeps the military (the "right people in the military) in control will prevent chaos.
"What's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them."
Wrong--looking more and more as if the military was the power behind the curtain. They wanted Mubarak out so that his son would not take over and the fact that the old guy is 82 made them believe the time for the transfer of power to the son was arriving and they weren't about to let that happen.
"...events there are important, whether you want them to be or not."
That doesn't mean they're exciting. And when the events in question are important yet drearily predictable, the chance of my being excited by them is less than zero.
Yes, because you're very far from Egypt...We in Italy are very angry because the stupid politic of Obama and HRC that now cost us thousand tunisians with cellphone in boat people. We will regret BenAlì and Mubarak, and I hope not also Gheddafi too.
Well, airtommy, you're wrong, but I'm sure you score some conservativer-than-thou points with SOMEONE for asserting that trouble hasn't been brewing, under Islamic fundamentalist influence, in Egypt, for decades.
Some RADICAL differences between Iran '79 and Egypt '10:
Both Muslim Both led by US-backed dictators Both dictators known mainly for torture The US will be blamed for both revolutions Commodity prices key in both situations Both Muslim Both countries Islamic Both countries full of Muslims
In other words, are the high IQ men producing more kids or are the low IQ men producing more ?
It would seem to me that if we wanted to construct a society with the highest possible IQ we would want to have the men with the highest IQ have the most children.
What about an examination system in which all boys were tested at the age of 13 to determine IQ, and the 25% of boys that had the highest IQ were each married to four females their own age. The 75% of males who were not allowed to marry would have unlimited inexpensive access to infertile prostitutes.
It has been put forth as a hypothesis that the men who are denied the right to marry might refuse to be productive members of society. how much evidence is there that this is really the case? It seems that throughout history certain men who don't marry have indeed been productive
It has often been said that the chinese exam system insured that super high IQ chinese got to have many many more wives and offspring than average IQ chinese men. However, not it appears that the impact of this was not great.
Can any students of history tell me what actual historical societies came the closest to the model of having the highest IQ males marry four females and the majority of males not marry?
"What's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them." http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/66178/steven-a-cook/is-el-baradei-egypts-hero
CFR was clearly "behind" it.
Field Marshall Tantawi is now in charge, and that's supposed to be a good thing??
1. Algeria in chaos as the Islamists try once again to seize power.
2. Tunisians descending en-masse to Lampedusa and Sicily in boatlifts. Many of them suspected terrorists freed by the new regime.
3. The Iranian Naval task force making a PORT CALL in Jeddah Saudi Arabia on the Red Sea.
4. Iranian troops and missiles in Eritrea.
5. Rumors of the Iranian Naval task force transiting the Suez Canal to the Med.
Basically, the US (under Muslim President Obama) is being muscled aside after nearly 65 years of US policy (to control the flow of oil through the Persian Gulf, dating back to FDR) by IRAN. Fueled by the Islamist popular uprisings around the Arab world.
That's not good if you like living outside the Central City (how's Westlake district looking these days? Oh yeah right MS-13) and being able to actually afford to drive a car.
I have to keep reminding myself that whiskey's delusional, I'll-informed rants aren't actually reason not to worry about the future government of Egypt and other nearby countries. Even a fool is right now and then, albeit likely for the wrong reasons.
In the meantime, it's heartening to see a kleptocratic thug chased from power, even knowing he'll likely be replaced by another kleptocratic thug.
"Oh, c'mon Steve. Really? It's exciting, and I'm not being sarcastic. Thousands of people rise up in popular revolt and throw out - or, rather, motivate the Army to throw out - a corrupt and unpopular dictator, and we can watch the whole thing live. How can that not be moving and exciting?"
I agree with both you and Steve. Yes, it is exciting as events unfold--with protests, riots, violence, Mubarak leaving, etc--, but in the end, will Egypt really change? Remember the Orange Revolution in Ukraine? What really changed? Mubarak or no Mubarak, Egypt will be a dysfunctional nation with too many mouths to feed(and not enough brains to come up with solutions).
Whiskey-tard, tell us what you think 1910 was like. Are you aware that four years later, warmongering of idiots like you caused a fought a western-civilization breaking war for nothing?
Svigor sez: I don't think Whiskey gives a flying $#@% about oil independence. That's just a guess based on how he never talks about it, almost assumes it's impossible, in fact almost hopes it's impossible.
Whiskey's worry is poor Israel. The oil argument is a straw-man. The thing I keep worrying about is that Whiskey may in fact not be Jewish. If so, he is drawing a lot of ire to justify a bunch of people which look down on him.
"Can you take a break from your HBD-centric views and acknowledge the incredible moment created by the Egyptian people?"
Why should we? It's not nearly as impressive as the moment created by the American people just a few scant years ago, you know, the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal--that moment.
Now, if the Egyptian people do something comparable, say, move the Pyramids or reverse the course of the Nile, then we'll all take a break from our HBD-centric views to acknowledge that incredible moment.
"Why should we? It's not nearly as impressive as the moment created by the American people just a few scant years ago, you know, the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal--that moment."
Sure. Can we also acknowledge that people like you--who attest to the fundamental decency of the white culture that minorities are now exploiting--are not a testament to that fundamental decency at all. In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all.
In other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot.
"Can we also acknowledge that people like you--who attest to the fundamental decency of the white culture that minorities are now exploiting--are not a testament to that fundamental decency at all. In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all."
People like me aren't double-damned stupid enough to attest or claim any such thing.
And nowhere in my comment that you quoted did I mention race, white, black or other--you did. You're the one who rushed in to put a racial spin on my remarks and then criticize me not for what I said but for what you mendaciously claim I said. (Yes, I am calling you a liar.)
"In other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot."
As opposed to the vibrance and creativity of non-whites generally and enlightened whites such as yourself. Right.
If you cheer for the regime change in Egypt you are a stupid evil neocon. But if you take the opposite view because you worry about Muslim Brotherhood, you are a stupid evil war-mongering neocon too! So what's a poor paleo to do? Claim indifference, of course.
(I don't mean Steve here. His point seems to be that we should pay as much attention to Mexico as to Egypt.)
In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all.
In other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot.
What may be the most interesting aspect is the very low "g" level of the huge population base in Egypt, which base is rural and village. MSM talking heads just know, know, know this obscured fact of life had nothing at all to do with why the regime was so disposed against Western democracy models.
People like Whiskey make foreign policy for the Republican party. You may not agree with his views, but those views are pretty mainstream with the NY-DC-Fox News neoconservative crowd. I've actually heard Glenn Beck talk about an Egyptian Muslim Caliphate conquering Europe and then threatening to invade America.
Way back in 2008, McCain was singing songs about bombing Iran ("Bomb, bomb, bomb.... bomb, bomb Iran") and even agreed that we should consider using nuclear weapons against the regime. Senator Mccain also wanted to select Joe Lieberman as his running mate and even let Joe give a key note speech at the Republican National Convention.
People like Whiskey make foreign policy for the Republican party...I've actually heard Glenn Beck talk about an Egyptian Muslim Caliphate conquering Europe and then threatening to invade America.
Does anyone here watch Glenn Beck? Is that where Whiskey picks up his crazy? If it isn't, Whiskey could probably get a job as a writer for that show. Tell em the speedboat invasion shit, and the they'll be hooked.
Egypt - GDP 216 billion Egypt - population 80+ million
Louisiana - GDP 208 billion Louisiana - population 4.5 million
Egypt needs to create lots of jobs for all those people. Good luck!
Sport, for all you know -- given the logic on display in your comment -- Egypt already has full employment.
Whiskey-tard, tell us what you think 1910 was like. Are you aware that four years later, warmongering of idiots like you caused a fought a western-civilization breaking war for nothing?
Zing. You can just imagine Whiskey's Scots-Irish ancestors assuring the lads they'll "be 'ome by Christmas!"
In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all.
In other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot.
"'In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all.
In other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot.'
Another zing."
It is only if, as you apparently do, one reads for content but not for context.
"Why should we? It's not nearly as impressive as the moment created by the American people just a few scant years ago, you know, the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal--that moment."
Yeah, I was pretty partial to the Obama election also.
rob:I'm sure many paleos won't like it, race mixing, magic, etc. I think the woman who wrote the books the show is based on is a liberal, but she's a Southern liberal who actually likes the South.
>Can you take a break from your HBD-centric views and acknowledge the incredible moment created by the Egyptian people?
People, humans, with "equal centers of self," as George Eliot would say.<
Another believing mind.
Yes, it's the greatest and most inspiring spiritual moment of all of History! Not just Humanity's history - but the Entire Universe's history! (singing with tears collecting on my chin): "Mine eyes have seen the coming of the glory of the Lord..."
Meanwhile - back in the reality of grown-ups, men, and logic - the poor Egyptian boobs will be saddled with another master, and will grind on, world without end.
But keep waving your kumbayah flag in an angry snit. You are incomparably entertaining.
America should make it a point to keep out of the internal affairs of other nations. If the Egyptian people want to vote in the Muslim Brotherhood, that's too bad - but it's their choice. If the Egyptians want to become a tourism hub and regional economic powerhouse, good for them - but it's their choice.
We don't need to be in the business of picking and choosing leaders, then propping them up with aid and behind the scenes wheeling and dealing. The benefits to the American people are dubious, the cost is high, and all this meddling just increases anti-American sentiment abroad.
People that warn about an upcoming Islamic Caliphate are hysterical. The Muslims have too many internal divisions to make them capable of coalescing into a united military force. They also don't have the industrial or economic base to threaten us. They do have the potential to annoy and harasss us, but they can't bring down Western civilization - unless we let our birthrates drop down low and allow Muslim immigrants to demographically swamp us. It's always struck me as ironic that neoconservatives advocate open borders to all and military action overseas, then wonder why we have Islamization occuring in Western Europe and North America.
Seal the borders, take immigration to zero, and stay out of other countries' affairs. Trust me, the goat herders of Afghanistan and the Muslim Brotherhood taxi drivers of Egypt are not going to conquer Washington DC or Bussels.
The "g" comparisons in the work of Richard Lynn and collaborators would seem to impart voltage to the Egyptian situation. A very central problem for Egypt in effective self-government with any elements of democratic process is simply overall low "g". The protesters in the streets are not at all representative of the large population base.
You'll certainly be excited Steve if AQ waltzes into control, with the MB (they are basically the same branches of the same Salafist movement). Or if Saudi falls.
ReplyDeleteLike driving your car much? Not paying $10 or more a gallon? Yep then what happens in the ME matters. That's the cost of those cheap sneakers and Ipods.
Oh, c'mon Steve. Really? It's exciting, and I'm not being sarcastic.
ReplyDeleteThousands of people rise up in popular revolt and throw out - or, rather, motivate the Army to throw out - a corrupt and unpopular dictator, and we can watch the whole thing live. How can that not be moving and exciting?
Furthermore, this happens in a populous country with a long, interesting history that in antiquity was central to the development of Western civilization. In modern times, Egypt is a key part of the Arab and Islamic worlds, with which are in perpetual conflict. (It doesn't matter whether the Stevosphere thinks we shouldn't be involved in the Middle East ... in fact, we are, so events there are important, whether you want them to be or not.)
And then there's the whole technological angle of it. Regardless of the role they are ultimately found to have played in the final outcome, "social media" DID play a critical role in getting the revolt started, keeping it going, and maintaining international attention.
Right now, this feels like the revolution that Mark Zuckerberg built. I'm sure that will turn out to be a wild exaggeration, but for the moment, it's a cool concept to think about. How can you not be interested?
Whatever happens will happen whether or not Steve is excited about it.
ReplyDeleteThis situation is so much like Iran '79 it's spooky.
ReplyDeleteYou see the excitement in the crowds and you realize that the euphoria will not, cannot last when the jobs do not magically appear.
ReplyDelete"Like driving your car much? Not paying $10 or more a gallon? Yep then what happens in the ME matters. That's the cost of those cheap sneakers and Ipods."
ReplyDeleteDon't get your shorts in a twist. I was just reading the other day that US oil companies were dramatically increasing the output of domestic oil fields using new techniques in hydraulic fracturing of shale. Our dependence on foreign oil is about to decline 50% in the next 10 years, no thanks to the Obama Administration. Moreover, I read somewhere else that Saudi oil reserves are overstated by as much as 40%. By the time the Mideast situation becomes intractable, it will become East Asia's problem since they are the biggest consumers of Mideast oil.
And you know what, that's just what AQ and the Muslim Brotherhood deserve: ruthless Chinese coming after them -- instead of water boarding, the PLA will revive such wonderful ancient Chinese customs as death by a thousand cuts, which is essentially giving you morphine, then using a knife to slowly strip the flesh from your extremities before snapping them off. Finally, they perform a vivisection and puncture your heart when they get bored -- which can take up to a day. All the while, a gracious man stands patiently at the ready holding a wicker basket to catch the pieces of you as they are removed.
Steve Wood:
ReplyDelete"central to the development of Western civilization"
Eh? Maybe some influence on Minoan Crete, but hardly 'central'.
Or are you thinking Akhenaten cult > Judaism > Christianity?
I've said it elsewhere and I'll say it here: this could be either the best thing to happen to the Egyptian birth rate (an increased sense of participation in society = a tendency to reduce fertility, e.g., blacks in South Africa post-apartheid) or the worst (the end of Mubarak's family planning policies, perhaps even the establishment of a pro-natalist Islamist regime like in Iran post 1979, though I find that unlikely.) I think the former is more likely than not, since the fertility decline in Egypt has stalled because the fertility of the middle and upper classes has remained high, and they are the most likely to perceive themselves as benefiting materially from the regime change.
ReplyDeleteOn the other hand, Egypt could continue to chug along at 3 births per woman, hemorrhaging emigrants for decades to come. Poor Italy. :(
Don't get your shorts in a twist. I was just reading the other day that US oil companies were dramatically increasing the output of domestic oil fields using new techniques in hydraulic fracturing of shale. Our dependence on foreign oil is about to decline 50% in the next 10 years, no thanks to the Obama Administration. Moreover, I read somewhere else that Saudi oil reserves are overstated by as much as 40%. By the time the Mideast situation becomes intractable, it will become East Asia's problem since they are the biggest consumers of Mideast oil.
ReplyDeleteI don't think Whiskey gives a flying $#@% about oil independence. That's just a guess based on how he never talks about it, almost assumes it's impossible, in fact almost hopes it's impossible.
He can always correct me if I'm wrong.
Reportedly it was emphasized (see American Renaissance homepage re
ReplyDeletean improv meeting held after the
cancellation in Charlotte ) in this
improv gathering that the relatively low Egyptian IQ might not sustain fledgling democracy. Already, there's more chanting than
discourse; and more passion about abstract freedoms than regard to here-and-now economic re-starting.
Eh? Maybe some influence on Minoan Crete, but hardly 'central'.
ReplyDeleteOK, I exaggerated. Really, it was just central to my primary education in the 1960s, when we were taught about Egypt, Greece and Rome sequentially, although I must admit that only the Greece -> Rome connection was discussed. Egypt was probably in there because it happened in the Med, had a Biblical connection (which of course was never mentioned in our very progressive curriculum, but we all knew about it) and was cool, what with hieroglyphics, pyramids, mummies and the like.
Right now, this feels like the revolution that Mark Zuckerberg built...
ReplyDelete-er- stole.
Gotta agree with Whiskey - if the Muslim Brotherhood comes to power in Egypt, then we've got a disaster on our hands.
ReplyDeleteHopefully there's a Putin in the Egyptian army [or the in Egyptian intelligence services] who can crack a few heads, and keep that from happening, but, if not, then, well, yikes...
I certainly would not want to be a Copt [or any other Christian] in Egypt right now.
"I was just reading the other day that US oil companies were dramatically increasing the output of domestic oil fields using new techniques in hydraulic fracturing of shale. Our dependence on foreign oil is about to decline 50% in the next 10 years, no thanks to the Obama Administration."
ReplyDeleteBoy, I'd like a link to read about this. Thanks.
http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/02/11/top-public-high-schools-admit-fewer-blacks-and-hispanics/?ref=nyregion
ReplyDeleteI feel the same, man... I mean, in one way believe the rebellion might fight back against US imperialism - I love America, but you guys should listen to Pat Buchanan, at least in foreign and immigration policy - and lessen the Israeli stronghold on the Middle Eastt. On the other hand, I'm European, I sympathize with European peoples all over the world, and, considering the current state of the world, I've would like to focuse more on them, rather than on Arabs.
ReplyDeleteI'm mighty drunk, right now, so, I apologize for all the spelling errors in the text. (Not to mention the stylistic fuck-ups, that surely exist.)
@Steve Wood,
ReplyDeleteYour boundless enthusiasm almost got me going there for a minute.
Then I remembered that we were talking about the boring old Middle East.
Seriously, though. A populist uprising backed by the military in an unstable region doesn't seem to me to be cause for rejoicing.
Wait till it sinks in that no jobs will magically appear and that the hard work of establishing a viable government is just beginning.
How can that [throwing out a dictator] not be moving and exciting?
ReplyDeleteThey threw out a bad guy and guess what? within no time flat they'll be slavering for a worse guy, probably with a towel wound round his head, to dictate every last move they make. Depressing is what it is.
I think Whiskey is right. Egypt is almost uncannily like Afghanistan. Thousands of years of civilization, endless goat herders and mountains, a thin strip of good land in an almost endless dessert, graveyard of empires.... Wait a minute! They aren't alike at all. He's wrongedy wrong wrong!
ReplyDeleteSvigor, Whiskey doesn't want oil independence. He likes the dependence as a reason for warmongering. I wish he gave investment advice. I could do the opposite and get rich.
This situation is so much like Iran '79 it's spooky.
ReplyDeleteEgypt 2010 is so different than Iran 1979 it's hard to believe anyone could make such a comparison. Iran had a vibrant Islamic movement with a popular charismatic leader. Iran's revolution was several years in the making. Egypt's revolution was completely spontaneous, disorganized, and took place in about a week. Egypt's Islamic movement (Muslim Brotherhood) is feeble and has been collaborating with the CIA for half a century. They have no leadership or direction. Even during this brief revolution they have been indecisive. The Brotherhood is a bitter enemy of Al Qaeda.
output of domestic oil fields using new techniques in hydraulic fracturing of shale
ReplyDeletecost more per gallon still, sweetheart, so oil's going to keep going up in price, especially since the fed keeps printing money to keep the deratives invested banks afloat.
As for Egypt, if they balk at israel that could give the neocons a new country du jour to advocate bombing. it would be pretty hard for petty dicators to give up that aid though..
Well, according to kristof from the NYtimes, Mubarak has always been a military dictatorship in sheep's clothes.
ReplyDeleteThere is widespread speculation that Suleiman or whatever, who is the torturer-in-chief will succeed Mubarak.
Expect either harsher crackdowns in the vein of Myanmar's 88 revolution, or more protest and bloodshed.
There is widespread speculation that Suleiman or whatever, who is the torturer-in-chief will succeed Mubarak.
ReplyDeletehe'll be a pro israel shrill. CIA backed, I beleive.
Online forum discussion of rock music -- enthusiasm about something fascinating.
ReplyDeleteOp-eds, blogs, comments, etc., about current events in the Middle East -- enthusiasm about something pointless.
Davos, Gates Foundation, UN style conferences on the Middle East -- tedium about something pointless.
Academic arts journals -- tedium about something fascinating.
(Paraphrasing Taleb here.)
The costs of high IQ are clear based on where in the above places they like to hang out.
I'm reminded of an old David Frost joke:
ReplyDelete"There's going to be another general election in Greece. And we all know which generals are going to be elected."
Swap Egypt for Greece, and it may not be so far off the mark.
Mark Zuckerberg's revolution
ReplyDeleteWell, let's see
1) 1848, thousands of Europeans man barricades against the reaction, fueled by pamphleteers
2) 1917 Lenin arrives at Finland station, gets control, I believe, of a radio station
3) 1956 Maygars mass in Budapest -- only to be shot down
4) 1968 Czech Spring in Prague
5) 1968 Mass student demonstrations throughout Western Europe and the US -- including Chicago Democratic Convention. LBJ declines to continue his reelection bid
6) 1979 Shah is toppled by mass demonstration in Iran
7) 1986 Marcox is toppled by 'people power' in the Filipines
8) 1988 Mass songfests in Talin and Vilnius help lead to crack up of Soviet union
9) 1989 Mass demostrations aginst Chinese Communist Party
10) 2000 B*92 radio in Belgrade helps bring Milosevic down
11) 2003-2006 Various mass, 'color coded' 'revolutions' , some successful, some not
So basically, 160 years of mass demonstartion/revolution. In each people, naturally, used the latest technology, but it hardly seems that any specific technology, let alone facebook, was necessary, sufficient, or really even a critical (rather than 'nice to have, esp. for outsiders) feature.
Our dependence on foreign oil is about to decline 50% in the next 10 years
ReplyDeleteWhatever. The AP article on this says the Credit Suisse analyst projects that imports could be slashed by 60% by 2020, but that's dependent on expansion of Gulf production and reduction in gasoline demand (everyone's gonna get a Volt, I guess) in addition to the hydrofrac production to come.
The new fields are expected to generate a max of 2 million barrels/day by 2010. This is great news, the best news on the oil front I've read in a while.
But...current domestic production is about 6 million barrels/day. IIRC, decline rates on current domestic fields are maybe 4-5% per year. So in ten years we will lose 2.5 million of the current 6 million bpd. So these new hydrofrac fields may hold us even. Current Gulf production is something like 2 million bpd - I'm not an expert, but I'm not sure you can at least double the Gulf in 10 years, given existing wells tend to decline over time, which you really have to do to cut imports.
That leaves imports, which at 15 million or so bpd, would need to go down to 6 million bpd in this scenario. Just don't see how that's possible - no way in 9 years you can get a large enough portion of the population using unproven, expensive electrics that lack adequate range. If my logic is wrong, I will humbly accept correction.
But please don't construe anything I've said to mean I agree with Whiskey. The Arabs will need to sell us oil if they plan to eat. I hope I live long enough to see the day when we don't need their oil and can tell them to fuck off.
A testament to the universal gullibility of humankind.
ReplyDeleteIf American's falls for the same old "Hope and Change" trope every 4yrs only to get the same old, same old, what chance does Egypt have.
C'mon guys, give Steve a break, he hates anti-semites. Preemptively and for all time.
ReplyDeleteWhat's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them.
ReplyDeleteEarly days still, Steve.
ReplyDeleteWe have to wait and see if the muslim brotherhood (as seems likely) efectively forms the next government.
Then it'll be a game changer in the middle-east.What with Hmas beating Israel in Lebanon in 2008 (new tactics), a nuclear armed Iran and the demographic Palestinian explosion - will make for interesting times.I'll lay odds on the state of Israel not existing in 50 years' time - if this does or does not involve WW3 and nuclear weapons, I don't know.
If the hispanic/black dominated USA of that time will even get involved is doubtful.
And that's just for starters.What about that corrupt and horrible Saudi regime and half the world's oli reserves?
"What's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them."
ReplyDeleteHow do you know?
Reportedly...the relatively low Egyptian IQ might not sustain fledgling democracy. Already, there's more chanting than
ReplyDeletediscourse; and more passion about abstract freedoms than regard to here-and-now economic re-starting.
AND...
I'm reminded of an old David Frost joke:
"There's going to be another general election in Greece. And we all know which generals are going to be elected."
Swap Egypt for Greece, and it may not be so far off the mark.
There was an entertaining (well it made me giggle) article in The (London) Times last year from Rod Liddle regarding the Southern European debt crisis, and noting how it wasn't that long ago that all these countries were run by Colonels, Fascists or some other variety of authoritarian regime.
He doesn't join the dots (naturally) but what little numbers I've seen indicate that perhaps the nations of Southern Europe work better that way. I suspect most rail users prefer trains to run on time.
IT is entirely possible that for a variety of reasons, democracy only works for some peoples - and not others.
Or is that crazy racist talk?
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/rod_liddle/article7114008.ece
It’s not just the Greeks – beware of all the siesta states
Mainstream media now reports Mubarak is believed to be one of the world's richest men, worth maybe 50 billion dollars. Looks like he was pretty good at squirreling away the "aid" we were giving Egypt. If true then the utter greed of such kleptocrats is really astounding, as if one can't take care of their family and themselves for a mere one billion of stolen money. Information like this just becomes public when it's all over; before that it's all hush-hush. Makes one look around at all our other "allies" for hire and try to guess which one will be the next to go; might make a nice betting game.
ReplyDeleteThe question that most perplexes me about the situation in Egypt. Where are they finding all of that acid-washed denim?
ReplyDeleteEgypt - GDP 216 billion
ReplyDeleteEgypt - population 80+ million
Louisiana - GDP 208 billion
Louisiana - population 4.5 million
Egypt needs to create lots of jobs for all those people. Good luck!
The difference between Mubarak and any successor is the difference between Tweedledum and Tweedledee.
ReplyDeleteIt's no use arguing with the idiots who believe otherwise. These idiots have what Mencken called "believing minds." Their starry eyes look for the millennium. In America they are either Republicans in a big box church, or Obama-bumper-sticker types.
As to Amurica's energy dependence upon the Semitic East: just engage in a crash program, WW2-style, to bring a bunch of nuke plants on line. That is a fantasy only because it cannot get that bad. As innumerable realists have pointed out, Tweedledum and Tweedledee have to sell the oil to someone, or they're nothing; nor will they sell it at gouging prices if they know what's good for them. I am there referring to Amurica's other, existing nuclear capacities.
By the way, Amurica gets at least as much of its junk from other sources as it does from the Semitic East - Venezuela, for example. But don't raise this point to the idiots; let them enjoy their TV dramas. So long as their eyes are glued to their screens and their hands are waving green or orange or cedar- or denim-covered flags, they are too occupied to be causing much trouble.
"What's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them."
ReplyDeleteLOL.
You are kidding...right?
Anon said:
ReplyDeleteYou see the excitement in the crowds and you realize that the euphoria will not, cannot last when the jobs do not magically appear.
And then you think of the deep freeze in Mexico and realize that the food will not magically appear, either in Mexico or Egypt ...
and then you realize that the shit is about to hit the fan.
Anon:
ReplyDeleteIndeed, they had a major power backing the existing dictator, albeit one that wasn't going to cheer images of civilians being machine-gunned down.
What's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them.
ReplyDeleteHow do you know?
The military wanted the 82 year old Mubarak out and tried to get him to go gracefully, but when he wouldn't do so, this was the result.
ReplyDeleteIt's a fair guess that the military was part and parcel of the social network ousting. If it was not they who instigated it, it was certainly they who orchestrated it once its seed had sprouted.
As the rest of the country was quiet, this was not the popular revolution the Western press imagines, but rather the successful coup by the military.
It can turn out well or badly for both us and the Egyptian people.
Only a system that keeps the military (the "right people in the military) in control will prevent chaos.
"What's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them."
ReplyDeleteWrong--looking more and more as if the military was the power behind the curtain. They wanted Mubarak out so that his son would not take over and the fact that the old guy is 82 made them believe the time for the transfer of power to the son was arriving and they weren't about to let that happen.
This is newsworthy?
ReplyDeleteBeing geographically challenged, I doubt I could find Egypt on a map. But I was braced for this from the first reports of protests in Cairo.
Egypt Military falls out with protesters.
"...events there are important, whether you want them to be or not."
That doesn't mean they're exciting. And when the events in question are important yet drearily predictable, the chance of my being excited by them is less than zero.
Wake me when the Pyramids start to move.
Yes, because you're very far from Egypt...We in Italy are very angry because the stupid politic of Obama and HRC that now cost us thousand tunisians with cellphone in boat people. We will regret BenAlì and Mubarak, and I hope not also Gheddafi too.
ReplyDeleteWell, airtommy, you're wrong, but I'm sure you score some conservativer-than-thou points with SOMEONE for asserting that trouble hasn't been brewing, under Islamic fundamentalist influence, in Egypt, for decades.
ReplyDeleteWhatever.
Some RADICAL differences between Iran '79 and Egypt '10:
ReplyDeleteBoth Muslim
Both led by US-backed dictators
Both dictators known mainly for torture
The US will be blamed for both revolutions
Commodity prices key in both situations
Both Muslim
Both countries Islamic
Both countries full of Muslims
Is fertility in Egypt dysgenic or eugenic?
ReplyDeleteIn other words, are the high IQ men producing more kids or are the low IQ men producing more ?
It would seem to me that if we wanted to construct a society with the highest possible IQ we would want to have the men with the highest IQ have the most children.
What about an examination system in which all boys were tested at the age of 13 to determine IQ, and the 25% of boys that had the highest IQ were each married to four females their own age. The 75% of males who were not allowed to marry would have unlimited inexpensive access to infertile prostitutes.
It has been put forth as a hypothesis that the men who are denied the right to marry might refuse to be productive members of society. how much evidence is there that this is really the case? It seems that throughout history certain men who don't marry have indeed been productive
It has often been said that the chinese exam system insured that super high IQ chinese got to have many many more wives and offspring than average IQ chinese men. However, not it appears that the impact of this was not great.
Can any students of history tell me what actual historical societies came the closest to the model of having the highest IQ males marry four females and the majority of males not marry?
"What's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them." http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/66178/steven-a-cook/is-el-baradei-egypts-hero
ReplyDeleteCFR was clearly "behind" it.
Field Marshall Tantawi is now in charge, and that's supposed to be a good thing??
Hotair is reporting:
ReplyDelete1. Algeria in chaos as the Islamists try once again to seize power.
2. Tunisians descending en-masse to Lampedusa and Sicily in boatlifts. Many of them suspected terrorists freed by the new regime.
3. The Iranian Naval task force making a PORT CALL in Jeddah Saudi Arabia on the Red Sea.
4. Iranian troops and missiles in Eritrea.
5. Rumors of the Iranian Naval task force transiting the Suez Canal to the Med.
Basically, the US (under Muslim President Obama) is being muscled aside after nearly 65 years of US policy (to control the flow of oil through the Persian Gulf, dating back to FDR) by IRAN. Fueled by the Islamist popular uprisings around the Arab world.
That's not good if you like living outside the Central City (how's Westlake district looking these days? Oh yeah right MS-13) and being able to actually afford to drive a car.
In other words, its not 1910 any more.
Whiskey, quit copying and pasting Neocon propaganda on this blog. It's not helping your cause. It only makes you look bad.
ReplyDeleteI have to keep reminding myself that whiskey's delusional, I'll-informed rants aren't actually reason not to worry about the future government of Egypt and other nearby countries. Even a fool is right now and then, albeit likely for the wrong reasons.
ReplyDeleteIn the meantime, it's heartening to see a kleptocratic thug chased from power, even knowing he'll likely be replaced by another kleptocratic thug.
"Oh, c'mon Steve. Really? It's exciting, and I'm not being sarcastic.
ReplyDeleteThousands of people rise up in popular revolt and throw out - or, rather, motivate the Army to throw out - a corrupt and unpopular dictator, and we can watch the whole thing live. How can that not be moving and exciting?"
I agree with both you and Steve. Yes, it is exciting as events unfold--with protests, riots, violence, Mubarak leaving, etc--, but in the end, will Egypt really change?
Remember the Orange Revolution in Ukraine? What really changed?
Mubarak or no Mubarak, Egypt will be a dysfunctional nation with too many mouths to feed(and not enough brains to come up with solutions).
Whiskey-tard, tell us what you think 1910 was like. Are you aware that four years later, warmongering of idiots like you caused a fought a western-civilization breaking war for nothing?
ReplyDeleteCan you take a break from your HBD-centric views and acknowledge the incredible moment created by the Egyptian people?
ReplyDeletePeople, humans, with "equal centers of self," as George Eliot would say.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12441843?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Gee Whiskey, worried about poor Israel again?
ReplyDeleteSvigor sez:
ReplyDeleteI don't think Whiskey gives a flying $#@% about oil independence. That's just a guess based on how he never talks about it, almost assumes it's impossible, in fact almost hopes it's impossible.
Whiskey's worry is poor Israel. The oil argument is a straw-man. The thing I keep worrying about is that Whiskey may in fact not be Jewish. If so, he is drawing a lot of ire to justify a bunch of people which look down on him.
"Can you take a break from your HBD-centric views and acknowledge the incredible moment created by the Egyptian people?"
ReplyDeleteWhy should we? It's not nearly as impressive as the moment created by the American people just a few scant years ago, you know, the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal--that moment.
Now, if the Egyptian people do something comparable, say, move the Pyramids or reverse the course of the Nile, then we'll all take a break from our HBD-centric views to acknowledge that incredible moment.
Meanwhile, it's HBD-centric business as usual.
"Why should we? It's not nearly as impressive as the moment created by the American people just a few scant years ago, you know, the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal--that moment."
ReplyDeleteSure. Can we also acknowledge that people like you--who attest to the fundamental decency of the white culture that minorities are now exploiting--are not a testament to that fundamental decency at all. In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all.
In other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot.
"Can we also acknowledge that people like you--who attest to the fundamental decency of the white culture that minorities are now exploiting--are not a testament to that fundamental decency at all. In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all."
ReplyDeletePeople like me aren't double-damned stupid enough to attest or claim any such thing.
And nowhere in my comment that you quoted did I mention race, white, black or other--you did. You're the one who rushed in to put a racial spin on my remarks and then criticize me not for what I said but for what you mendaciously claim I said. (Yes, I am calling you a liar.)
"In other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot."
As opposed to the vibrance and creativity of non-whites generally and enlightened whites such as yourself. Right.
If you cheer for the regime change in Egypt you are a stupid evil neocon. But if you take the opposite view because you worry about Muslim Brotherhood, you are a stupid evil war-mongering neocon too! So what's a poor paleo to do? Claim indifference, of course.
ReplyDelete(I don't mean Steve here. His point seems to be that we should pay as much attention to Mexico as to Egypt.)
In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all.
ReplyDeleteIn other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot.
You write like a girl
Whiskey is Scotch-Irish.
ReplyDeleteWhat may be the most interesting aspect is the very low "g" level of the huge population base in Egypt, which base is rural and village. MSM talking heads just
ReplyDeleteknow, know, know this obscured fact of life had nothing at all
to do with why the regime was so
disposed against Western democracy models.
But if you take the opposite view because you worry about Muslim Brotherhood, you are a stupid evil war-mongering neocon too!
ReplyDeleteWorrying about the MB is called "sanity".
The folks on this thread who poo-poo the threat posed by the MB are f***ing nuts.
What Egyptians Want
ReplyDeletePeople like Whiskey make foreign policy for the Republican party. You may not agree with his views, but those views are pretty mainstream with the NY-DC-Fox News neoconservative crowd. I've actually heard Glenn Beck talk about an Egyptian Muslim Caliphate conquering Europe and then threatening to invade America.
ReplyDeleteWay back in 2008, McCain was singing songs about bombing Iran ("Bomb, bomb, bomb.... bomb, bomb Iran") and even agreed that we should consider using nuclear weapons against the regime. Senator Mccain also wanted to select Joe Lieberman as his running mate and even let Joe give a key note speech at the Republican National Convention.
Whiskey is in the driver's seat.
The folks on this thread who poo-poo the threat posed by the MB are f***ing nuts.
ReplyDeleteSeems to me that many of those concerned with Islamic extremism are tose most concerned with importing more Muslims. No Muslims, no MB, no problem.
People like Whiskey make foreign policy for the Republican party...I've actually heard Glenn Beck talk about an Egyptian Muslim Caliphate conquering Europe and then threatening to invade America.
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone here watch Glenn Beck? Is that where Whiskey picks up his crazy? If it isn't, Whiskey could probably get a job as a writer for that show. Tell em the speedboat invasion shit, and the they'll be hooked.
Egypt - GDP 216 billion
ReplyDeleteEgypt - population 80+ million
Louisiana - GDP 208 billion
Louisiana - population 4.5 million
Egypt needs to create lots of jobs for all those people. Good luck!
Sport, for all you know -- given the logic on display in your comment -- Egypt already has full employment.
Whiskey-tard, tell us what you think 1910 was like. Are you aware that four years later, warmongering of idiots like you caused a fought a western-civilization breaking war for nothing?
Zing. You can just imagine Whiskey's Scots-Irish ancestors assuring the lads they'll "be 'ome by Christmas!"
In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all.
In other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot.
Another zing.
Cracking thread.
"'In fact, many of those accomplishments of white culture that you proudly claim as your own--as a constituent member of the white race--are formed by people who are precisely unlike you at all.
ReplyDeleteIn other words, if the white race were made up of people like you, it would be an unimaginative, uninspiring, dull lot.'
Another zing."
It is only if, as you apparently do, one reads for content but not for context.
"Whiskey, quit copying and pasting Neocon propaganda on this blog. It's not helping your cause. It only makes you look bad."
ReplyDeleteI don't know if that is his concern.
""What's amazing about the Egyptian revolution is that they had no major power backing them."
ReplyDeleteLOL.
You are kidding...right?"
WOW! we really are making progress on this board. Six months ago that would have HAD to have been my response.
"Why should we? It's not nearly as impressive as the moment created by the American people just a few scant years ago, you know, the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal--that moment."
ReplyDeleteYeah, I was pretty partial to the Obama election also.
"Whiskey is Scotch-Irish."
ReplyDeleteSo is Michael Richards (wink).
rob: I'm sure many paleos won't like it, race mixing, magic, etc. I think the woman who wrote the books the show is based on is a liberal, but she's a Southern liberal who actually likes the South.
ReplyDeleteUhh, does Strom Thurmond count as a paleocon?
Truth: Yeah, well, except for the fact that she's been SLEEPING WITH A GUY WHO'S BEEN DEAD FOR 100 YEARS!
You guys act like you think that gun-toting whiskey-swigging southern white bible-thumpers don't like to get it on.
How do you think those 19 Duggar children got made? In a test tube?
And why do you think that the average "African-American" in this country is one-fifth Scots-Irish [many of them with blue or green eyes to prove it]?
I daresay that the typical conservative is getting a helluva lot more nookie than any uptight, neurotic, ingrate of a libtard [with "Mommy" issues].
Just ask Roissy.
>Can you take a break from your HBD-centric views and acknowledge the incredible moment created by the Egyptian people?
ReplyDeletePeople, humans, with "equal centers of self," as George Eliot would say.<
Another believing mind.
Yes, it's the greatest and most inspiring spiritual moment of all of History! Not just Humanity's history - but the Entire Universe's history! (singing with tears collecting on my chin): "Mine eyes have seen the coming of the glory of the Lord..."
Meanwhile - back in the reality of grown-ups, men, and logic - the poor Egyptian boobs will be saddled with another master, and will grind on, world without end.
But keep waving your kumbayah flag in an angry snit. You are incomparably entertaining.
America should make it a point to keep out of the internal affairs of other nations. If the Egyptian people want to vote in the Muslim Brotherhood, that's too bad - but it's their choice. If the Egyptians want to become a tourism hub and regional economic powerhouse, good for them - but it's their choice.
ReplyDeleteWe don't need to be in the business of picking and choosing leaders, then propping them up with aid and behind the scenes wheeling and dealing. The benefits to the American people are dubious, the cost is high, and all this meddling just increases anti-American sentiment abroad.
People that warn about an upcoming Islamic Caliphate are hysterical. The Muslims have too many internal divisions to make them capable of coalescing into a united military force. They also don't have the industrial or economic base to threaten us. They do have the potential to annoy and harasss us, but they can't bring down Western civilization - unless we let our birthrates drop down low and allow Muslim immigrants to demographically swamp us. It's always struck me as ironic that neoconservatives advocate open borders to all and military action overseas, then wonder why we have Islamization occuring in Western Europe and North America.
Seal the borders, take immigration to zero, and stay out of other countries' affairs. Trust me, the goat herders of Afghanistan and the Muslim Brotherhood taxi drivers of Egypt are not going to conquer Washington DC or Bussels.
The "g" comparisons in the work
ReplyDeleteof Richard Lynn and collaborators
would seem to impart voltage to
the Egyptian situation. A very
central problem for Egypt in
effective self-government with any elements of democratic process is simply overall low "g". The protesters in the streets are not at all representative of the large population base.