Mitch Daniels, the two-term Republican governor of Indiana is, as far as I can recall, the only potential President I've had dinner with a couple of times. (Note to future opposition researchers: I wasn't me back then, so don't bother.)
Nice guy. Didn't instantly come across as Presidential Timber. David Brooks writes in "Run, Mitch, Run:"
In manner, Daniels is not classically presidential. Some say he is short (though others do not regard 5 feet 7 inches as freakishly diminutive). He does not dominate every room he enters. But he is not without political skills, in an offbeat sort of way. If you have some time, Google “Mitch TV” and you can watch a few episodes of the reality show his campaign produced during his gubernatorial races.
Seemed like a bright corporate executive type, which I guess he was at the time. Andrew Ferguson writes: "He favors pressed sport shirts and sharply creased Dockers, public-golf-course casual," and that seems about how I recall him: like the kind of marketing research executive I used to play golf with. An impressive guy, but it's interesting to hat met somebody before they become a really big deal.
Interesting facts about Mitch Daniels:
- He's had two marriages and one wife. He and his wife, by whom he has four daughters, divorced in 1993 and remarried in 1997. In 1930s, remarriages were the favorite happy endings to screwball comedies, but they usually strike me as evidence of interesting internal passions not wholly consistent with his image of chipper blandness.
- He's Hillbilly/Arab-American. His mother was born Daisy Wilkes, while his paternal grandparents were born in Syria.
- Drugs form a continuing theme in his life. His father was a pharmaceutical salesman, he was arrested at Princeton in 1971 for LSD, and then he was, between government gigs, an Eli Lilly executive. When I mentioned to my wife that he was being mentioned as a Presidential candidate, she recalled how interested he'd been in her tale of one of her relatives' medical problem and how enthusiastically he had recommended a Lilly drug then in trial. (It turned out to be a bust, with some nasty side effects, but she appreciated his concern.)
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170 comments:
Another open-borders big-business socially liberal "Republican". No thanks.
Syrian and Lebanese Orthodox Christians aren't very Arab.
Is "Daniels" a common Syrian name, then?
He pussed out on the Right-To-Work issue in Indiana. Granted, he didn't want the fight in the first place, but that doesn't sell well once the fight has arrived. The base won't trust him, and I don't blame them.
Nope. He's dead. He threw Walker and WI Reps under the bus, doesn't want to take on Unions (Dem's open borders money machine) and is calling for a "truce" (surrender) on social issues.
He's a RINO. He's Joe Lieberman, basically. And as noted, open borders enthusiast.
Immigration restriction should be the main issue for the GOP. Unemployment is near 20% and an immigration moratorium is the fastest, cheapest(free!) and simplest remedy for the federal government to implement.
Who in the GOP is an advocate of immigration restriction that can win the nomination?
Unfortunately, both Christie and Daniels are terrible on immigration. The only electable candidate who is strong on illegal immigration is Pawlenty.
"I wasn't me back then": what? I picture you as Stephanie Sailer, the seductress of Savannah. Close?
I don't think this guy has the sand to be POTUS. Daniels is politician with book-keeping skills and nothing more.
Daniels doesn't have the sand to be POTUS. He's merely a politician with some accounting skills.
Mitch Daniels - who's he?
Hey, Steve how about this: in a weak GOP field, Christie is the “king actor.” If he isn’t cast as the highest authority character the nomination fight seems discombobulated to the audience.
Maybe Orson Welles was right – and who in the running for prez more resembles Welles than Gov. Christie?
I remember it was said that Bush's first cabinet included three Arabs but not a single Jew. Daniels was one of the three.
"Is "Daniels" a common Syrian name, then?"
You see a lot of Biblical names among Eastern Christians, such as Abraham.
Daniels' grandfather was named something like Elias Esau (a couple of more Biblical names). He picked the name Daniels upon immigrating, presumably as being simultaneously Syrian-sounding and English-sounding: a rather elegant choice.
"his paternal grandparents were born in Syria"
As a proud European American (i.e. white person), it would be difficult for me to vote for someone of non-European ancestry.
Unfortunately, NumbersUSA has not added him to its list how presidential hopefuls stand on immigration:
www.numbersusa.com/content/action/2012-presidential-hopefuls-immigration-stances.html
It's funny--Mitch Daniels seems to be the kind of guy that regular people run into. I wrote an op ed for the Washington Post and his people reached out to me specifically to tell me how much he'd liked it.
I wish "mainstream" Republicans would be willing to risk media wrath on immigration.
He picked the name Daniels upon immigrating, presumably as being simultaneously Syrian-sounding and English-sounding: a rather elegant choice.
Think Danny Thomas.
I'm with Thripshaw & Tino.
I am a single-issue voter. My single issue is "The National Question." Does the candidate want to preserve America's unique cultural & ethnic identity?
I don't care about the economy, guns, abortion, the Mideast, or anything else. I'd rather live in a poor US of A than a rich version of Brazil-with-Snow.
Daniels was unpopular in Northern Indiana after agreeing to lease the Indiana Toll Road to Cintra of
Spain for 75 years. He also served as Dubya's budget director which is nothing to be proud of.
"I am a single-issue voter. My single issue is "The National Question." Does the candidate want to preserve America's unique cultural & ethnic identity?
I don't care about the economy, guns, abortion, the Mideast, or anything else. I'd rather live in a poor US of A than a rich version of Brazil-with-Snow."
Agreed. I'd rather live in socialist white homogenous Sweden than in a libertarian multiracial Brazil or India.
As head of OMB under Buhs, Daniels inherited a surplus from Clinton and began the Bush deficits, still continuing under Obama. Daniels said the Iraq War would cost $60 billion. Current cost: from $1 trillion to $6 trillion, depending on how you figure it.
"'I don't care about the economy, guns, abortion, the Mideast, or anything else. I'd rather live in a poor US of A than a rich version of Brazil-with-Snow.'
Agreed. I'd rather live in socialist white homogenous Sweden than in a libertarian multiracial Brazil or India."
Whoa, not so fast there. Does the place name "Malmo" mean anything to you?
Unfortunately, whites have a tendency to think what works for them in homogenous societies works so darned well that they ought to invite others to share in their good fortune (and hard work). Swedes are particularly bad about this and just look where it's got them. And the Swedish brand of feminism is downright demented.
Sweden is not a nation I want any nation of mine to emulate.
And as far as guns go, I'm a law-abiding citizen with no criminal record whatsoever and no impulse to hurt anyone in any way but it's cold dead hands for me all the way.
Agreed. I'd rather live in socialist white homogenous Sweden than in a libertarian multiracial Brazil or India.
Whew - I dunno - which of the two alternatives gets a Second Amendment?
We Scots-Irishmen vote with our guns.
I am getting sick and tired of seeing the name of these liberal Republicans being thrown around as potential nominees for 2012, just because they want to cut spending. We should just change GOP to SCP (Spending Cut Party) and call it a day.
"Sweden is not a nation I want any nation of mine to emulate."
You got that backwards.
Nordic counties have historically been cultural lemmings within Western civilization. They typically follow the cultural trend of most powerful Western society of their time, and in our life time that role has been played by the US. Much of their multiculturalism philosophy is American in origin.
Yup. I say its spinich and to hell wih it,
"Who in the GOP is an advocate of immigration restriction that can win the nomination?"
Huckabee
The only candidate who openly committed to building the damned fence during the presidential campaign.
Well I would say that was not the most glowing recommendation.
Here are his "top" 5 books.
Just what we need - another corporate shill Republican presidential candidate.
Y'know I really miss Jerry Ford. And Mitch is the closest thing we have to that great Republican. Remember the Republicans actually preferred Jerry or Ron Reagan.
So c'mon Republicans, Mitch is everything you look for in a a candidate. Boring, establishment, a good "manager", & he's not one of those nasty populists or one of those showoff's that has charisma.
Plus, he's in favor open borders, will give us a VAT tax, tax cuts for the wealthy, and will be indifferent or liberal on the social issues.
He's Like Jerry Ford, only he's not dead.
"You got that backwards.
Nordic counties have historically been cultural lemmings within Western civilization...Much of their multiculturalism philosophy is American in origin."
Sorry I wasn't clearer. When I said "Sweden is not a nation I want any nation of mine to emulate", I didn't mean I don't want the US to emulate it. I meant were I to choose an entirely new nation (say, if the US split apart)in which to live, I'd not want that newly formed nation to resemble Sweden.
You are right in what you say, though. I recently read an article (can't remember where so no link) about how Sweden opened up to outsiders rather later than other nations and with a strong sense of guilt that led them quickly to disastrous excesses of multiculturalism.
'The only candidate who openly committed to building the damned fence'
Your memory is short. Tancredo was also running and he was even more of a hardliner than Huckabee. Maybe you only tuned in after Tom dropped out?
He seems to be doing a good job as Governor of Indiana. Leave him there.
Checked out a few links on that LSD thing. This picture of him during his college dope dealing days is a howler.
"Who in the GOP is an advocate of immigration restriction that can win the nomination?
Huckabee." Really, then why does Numbers USA give him a "D" rating.
From Wikipedia: "As governor Huckabee commuted and accepted recommendations for pardon for twice as many sentences as his three predecessors combined, in total 1,033 prisoners. Twelve of those had previously been convicted of murder." One of those receiving clemency was Maurice Clemmons. On Nov. 29, 2009, four police officers were murdered in Lakewood, Wash., and Clemmons was named by witnesses as the only suspect. Clemmons was killed in the ensuing manhunt.
Huckabee's frenetic pardoning averaged one per every four days of his term.
This sucker pardoned a whole penitentiary full of Willie Hortons and it won't take the second coming of Lee Atwater to nail him to the wall. Unless the Dems run Gaddafi, the Huck is dead meat, and deservedly so.
I remember at the time the reporting was referring to the letters he had received from clergy pleading for mercy for their pet inmates. Look, with all respect to believers, some of whom are as tough-minded as they come, there is no bigger mark for a prison-hardened con than a preacherman. They want and need to hear the "good news" about how the sinner turned his life around. We need to be protected from criminals, not to be made prey on account of some holy man's need to feel morally superior.
I hope Huck has a long career as Fox's answer to Bill Moyers.
Huck isn't running, but he could spell trouble for Romney. The dear Reverend Dimmesdale, it seems, is guilty of sin of envy.
Daniels comes off an an adult, but he has a lot of learning to do about what to say and how to say it.
No, I don't mean he needs to learn to be equivocating.
He needs to do what Christie does, which is be so to the point, so blunt, that no media out to get you can spin things from any ambiguous or off the cuff answer, even if you didn't try to dissemble.
Origin of "Presidential Timber."
This is my guess. In the old days, carpenters not only sawed boards and nailed them together, they also carefully chose which boards to use.
Back in those days, they didn't have pressure-treated, kiln-dried, uniform-sized 4x8 plywood. All they had was a lot of logs and boards of various sizes. Some were good; others not so good. The carpenter had to choose, and he had to know the difference between good timber and bad.
Carpenters would use special care in choosing timber for a roof beam of a house. They didn't want that beam to break.
So today we choose presidents in much the same way that carpenters used to choose pieces of wood. We look for one that can withstand the strain and pressure. That one is Presidential Timber.
"Syrian and Lebanese Orthodox Christians aren't very Arab."
Actually, they are Arab. Maybe you meant "they aren't very Muslim" which is true, but a very silly point to make.
"Is "Daniels" a common Syrian name, then?"
You see a lot of Biblical names among Eastern Christians, such as Abraham.
Arabs, like Scandinavians, used strict patronymics until fairly recently. Christian Arabs, however, tend to leave out the ibn favored by Moslems, so they appear to have a string of first names-- e.g. Danny Thomas, Jeff George, F. Murray (and Spencer) Abraham.
http://patronymic.askdefine.com/
Quite the opposite of WASPs like Millard Fillmore, Rutherford Birchard Hayes, Willard Mitt Romney...
"Hey, Steve how about this: in a weak GOP field, Christie is the “king actor.” If he isn’t cast as the highest authority character the nomination fight seems discombobulated to the audience.
Maybe Orson Welles was right – and who in the running for prez more resembles Welles than Gov. Christie?"
We have a winner.
Not Enough Hair
Yeah, that was Juan Amnesty McCain's campaign slogan, Fix the dang fence.
Despite how he postures for the base, Huckabee is another open boarder RINO. He just sells it as a white-guilt universalist Christian love to it.
Watch out for "Republicans" that the NYT writes love stories about.
...the nation is being given a chance to make up for past racism by the way it handles the influx of Hispanics.
Huckabee, a Republican who is considering a run for president in 2008, said Arkansas has made progress on racial justice and has a fresh opportunity to do the right thing in the way it welcomes the growing Hispanic population.
"One of the great challenges facing us is that we do not commit the same mistakes with our growing Hispanic population that we did with African Americans 150 years ago and beyond. We're still paying the price for the pathetic manner in which this country handled that," Huckabee said at a meeting of the Political Animals Club in Little Rock. The club meets monthly to hear from political figures and experts.
"I think frankly the Lord is giving us a second chance to do better than we did before," Huckabee said.
Steve, do you have anything to say about race-warrior Alphonse: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/26/nyregion/26dakota.html?hp
Levantine Christians... were building and defending western Civilization while most of your ancestors were living in huts...
So why do they turn their backs on their Phoenician and other Mediterranean heritage and today prefer to identify with the Arabs, a wild Johnny-come-lately race of desert interlopers who push a scary parody of their own faith?
The Greeks were once the apex of human civilization, and now they march in the street for benefits. Their Levantine neighbors suffered a similar fall.
"In America, Levantine Christians look, act, achieve, and vote like well-behaved white ethnics. And we were building and defending western Civilization while most of your ancestors were living in huts, worshipping oak trees and throwing each other into peat bogs."
That is the funniest thing that I have read all week. What is it with Mediterranean types (Jews, Greeks, Arabs) that give them superior senses of humor?
Also, no one mentioned another prominent Arab Orthodox Republican: Spencer Abraham. Notice the Semitic pattern with the family name?
On the "Right To Work" thing, Daniel Larison points out that Mitch Daniels achieved more extensive reforms than Scott Walker is even attempting way back in 2006.
The hostility to Daniels is perplexing, he's no RINO.
Yo Steve, how about an article about the new Texas census? You are a Rice grad, it seems that Texas will soon be New Mexico, what are your thoughts?
The Lebanese Americans I've known (Mayor Slay of St. Louis for example) seem as white as Greeks or Italians.
"I like most of the things Charles Murray has written," - Mitch Daniels
(from the link about his top 5 books)
Interesting. IQ realism, or just general support for intellectual honesty and good science, certainly doesn't mean that somebody understands the core questions: race, culture, civilization (immigration being one of the great threats). It's still a welcome sign.
This being said, I really don't see how a open borders, pro-business and social liberal Republican (even though I'm personally not much of a social conservative concerning abortion, homosexuality and the other hot button-issues) will beat Obama in 2012.
Also, he's 5'7.
“By 2040, 30 percent of Texas households will have less than a high-school education,” if nothing is done to boost the graduation rates of Hispanics, Murdock said.
This from an article on the 2010 census for Texas. Also news: Hispanics will be the largest ethnic group in Texas by 2015. Not 2050, or 2030, but 2015. Four years from now.
We're screwed.
Low tax Texas used to be the conservative model for how this nation could prosper with a large Hispanic population. Now they're facing a $25 billion budget deficit.
According to my own city paper, only 40% of Hispanics in my state manage to graduate from high school, and only 10% graduate from college, compared to 26% of whites. The paper is still an ardent advocate of amnesty.
Our elites have conspired to destroy this country in barely a generation. Taking it back will mean not only evicting the 11 million illegal aliens in our midst, but the millions of people granted automatic citizenship depsite their parents having been here illegally. That probably won't happen. Instead, we will slip gently into that good night.
Mitch Daniels was on PBS last night, and gee what a wan little quant. Obviously smart and sensible but unimposing.
He sounds great on the radio but it's hard to put the face with the voice.
Call them Assyrians, Phoenecians, Arabs, Lebano-Syrians, or whatever, but they have contributed a lot of good to the deep South since they arrived at the end of the 19th century. Hell, the Malouf family alone has done alot.
As my grandfather used to say, the best bootleggers around when the state was dry.
Kylie wrote:
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"You got that backwards.
Nordic counties have historically been cultural lemmings within Western civilization...Much of their multiculturalism philosophy is American in origin."
Sorry I wasn't clearer. When I said "Sweden is not a nation I want any nation of mine to emulate", I didn't mean I don't want the US to emulate it. I meant were I to choose an entirely new nation (say, if the US split apart)in which to live, I'd not want that newly formed nation to resemble Sweden.
You are right in what you say, though. I recently read an article (can't remember where so no link) about how Sweden opened up to outsiders rather later than other nations and with a strong sense of guilt that led them quickly to disastrous excesses of multiculturalism.
2/25/2011
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I am a Swede.
The elite is quite multiculti (we have a Congolese-born minister, and 2 of the 349 members of parliament are jews) but they are experiencing quite a lot of pushback from the electorate.
With a proportional parliament with multi-seat constituencies, we have 7 parties in the parliament, and there is no such thing as a uncontested or safe seat. The parliamentary voting system also ensures that political candidates are not overly dependent on donations of money - what they need is lots of unpaid labor from party members running the party candidacy. Note that I wrote party candidacy, not personal candidacy. Until quite recently the latter did not exist, and they are still quite uncommon. So, no party is greatly beholden to corporate paymasters. The parties get most of their money from state funds, in proportion to the number of seats that they have.
All this leads to a electoral climate in which lobbyists have much harder time getting their wishes enacted than in USA. Political power in Sweden rests on getting out the vote (generally, about 85-94% of the voting-age population votes in the parliamentary elections), not getting a big war chest. Money has its uses here also, but without lots of voters it quickly reaches a level of diminishing returns.
Therefore, the Swedish elite has a much harder time getting its wishes here than in the USA. There is a party called the Sweden Democrats which has immigration restriction/stopping, and they entered the parliament last fall, despite being hated by all media.
TBC in Part#2, real life interferes
"This sucker [Huckabee] pardoned a whole penitentiary full of Willie Hortons and it won't take the second coming of Lee Atwater to nail him to the wall. Unless the Dems run Gaddafi, the Huck is dead meat, and deservedly so...We need to be protected from criminals, not to be made prey on account of some holy man's need to feel morally superior."
Amen to that. You expressed my own view better than I could have. Thanks, Starker.
I think Paul Ryan has the best shot, though he says he isn't running. One can judge the strength of a sitting president by the timber of his opponents; the best don't waste their time and social capital on long shots.
He's only in the House, but he's extremely smart, and per Whiskey, good looking (sorry Whisk, but that he's white and blue-eyed makes him more attractive than Obama).
He made an extremely good impression on me when, as I mentioned before, Obama had a confab with a bunch of Republicans. Cantor did well, but Ryan did the best by a mile and instantly put himself on the radar.
Whisk,
I'll throw you a bone. I like Eric Cantor, too. Very dreamy accent, smart, and handsome.
You could have an all-Arab GOP ticket in '12 if you ran Daniels and Issa.
Issa is probably the most influential Arab-American politician in either party in this country's history, probably more than George Mitchell or John Sununu pere even. He's certainly the richest man in the current Congress of any ethnicity, and could finance a credible run for POTUS or VPOTUS out of his own pocket. And don't forget, even though he wanted to be the replacement himself, but for Issa, the whole Gray recall and ascent of Arnold would never have happened.
Of course, given his San Diego district I assume he's all for open borders.
Reg Caesar: I don't think Lebanese Americans do identify as Arab, or if they do, only in recent, post-p.c. generations. Did anyone ever think of Danny Thomas (or even his liberal daughter Marlo) as an Arab?
Interesting to hear people talking about America's "unique cultural and ethnic identity". Problem is that identity has been multi-cultural from very early on. In the 18th century you got the British-Scots complaining about how the Germans wouldn't assimilate. In the mid-19th, the Irish came aboard. Then in the late 19th/early 20th a whole host of Southern and Eastern Europeans ranging from Sicilians to Ukranians to Poles to Jews who were inarguably very distant from the northwestern European cultural origins of the country. And of course through all this a substantial African population -- I bet most of the posters here had their ancestors come to America much more recently than the typical African-American did (most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?). You can (and people here often do) say that American blacks are lazy, stupid, violent, etc. but it's blatantly ridiculous to say they're un-American.
Immigration and multi-culturalism are as American as apple pie. I personally think there's a very good pragmatic case for closing it down for a while (as we did after 1925), and that such a suspension would help preserve what's left of the mid-20th century American culture that I feel was our high point as a nation. But one reason that's so hard to do is that we are naturally an open and multi-ethnic country.
Another thing about CC and his weight--
Running for Pres is a tremendously physically taxing experience. I don't think he plans on running at all, just as he has said, but if and when he ever does, he will have to shed pounds just to get through the almost two years' worth of traveling, late nights, no sleep, bad food, constant on- the-move stuff.
There was a time long ago when a candidate didn't have to do that. No longer. I heard Mike Dukakis, who was in great physical shape, tell prospective Dem candidates who were thinking about running for Pres in '92, "You've got to realize just how very demanding it is from a physical standpoint."
I don't think CC could handle that. Now, perhaps the internet and new technologies might actually change the nature of campaigning even more than it already has, but for now at least, retail politics in the early stages in Iowa, NH, etc. is required, and criss-crossing the country and living on planes is as well.
"The hostility to Daniels is perplexing, he's no RINO."
I'm with you. There is no perfect candidate that satisfies even one person's political tastes, much less one that satisfies a needed segment of a party.
If you can get a guy who believes in fiscal responsibility and limited government, all things flow from that, including restraints on immigration, for everyone, including a bright guy like Daniels, realizes that importing poverty costs money.
"The Greeks were once the apex of human civilization, and now they march in the street for benefits. Their Levantine neighbors suffered a similar fall."
As do public employees in Wisconsin, the majority of whom are probably of Northern European ancestry.
"In America, Levantine Christians look, act, achieve, and vote like well-behaved white ethnics. And we were building and defending western Civilization while most of your ancestors were living in huts, worshipping oak trees and throwing each other into peat bogs."
This most certainly is not the case. Even in the most refined Christian towns in Lebanon, the social life there resembles nothing to that which you would normally see in North Western Europe. Despite *some* Levantines who have European features, the culture of Western Europeans and Levantines are very different. In NWE you do not see the same level of crassness, the same level of corruption, tribal nepotism, or gangsterism. Ask the Australians how much they love the "Lebs" and don't give me the bullshit that it's only Muslim Lebanese they don't like. The Christian Lebanese do not behave as well as Anglos in Australia. Any honest Australian will tell you that.
Don't give me that shit that it was a bunch of Christian Arabs who were building Western Civilization. That's a howler if I ever heard one. You contributed more to ISLAMIC CIVILIZATION than to Western Civilization by translating Greek literature into Arabic for your Muslim masters.
By the tone of your comment and the way your disparage Europe as being backwards, it's safe to say you have nothing in common with white ethnics except for Christianity.
Agreed. I'd rather live in socialist white homogeneous Sweden than in a libertarian multiracial Brazil or India.
So would any white with two brain cells to rub together. Systems and ideologies and fashions come and go; you can't just change your race or that of a nation like you can clothes, systems, or ideologies.
"Actually, they are Arab. Maybe you meant "they aren't very Muslim" which is true, but a very silly point to make."
Prolly meant "not very much like other Arabs" / "atypical among Arabs" ... probably since their culture has been guided by a different way of thinking about the world, for centuries.
" 'I like most of the things Charles Murray has written,'" - Mitch Daniels
Hell, that's more than a start--how many pols have ever read anything Murray has written, and how many who have would ever admit to "liking" Murray's analyses?
Sounds like a brave man, Daniels, don't you think?
Everyone keeps saying that Republicans won't vote for an open borders, pro-business, blah blah blah candidate, but that just don't seem true. You're basically describing Ronald Reagan, and Reagan-worship is still alive and well.
The bulk of the conservative base (Christian Zionists, Tea Partiers, libertarians, etc.), despite what many here would like to believe, is either pro-immigration or ambivalent about it. They'll vote for Reagan II in a heartbeat.
...we were building and defending western Civilization while most of your ancestors were living in huts, worshipping oak trees and throwing each other into peat bogs.
I'll give you the huts, but what's your problem with the latter two activities?
"Mitch Daniels, the two-term Republican governor of Indiana is, as far as I can recall, the only potential President I've had dinner with a couple of times. (Note to future opposition researchers: I wasn't me back then, so don't bother.)"
Doesn't matter, Steve. You just sealed his fate.
"Thus, with a blog, I damn him."
"Syrian and Lebanese Orthodox Christians aren't very Arab."
Actually, they are Arab. Maybe you meant "they aren't very Muslim" which is true, but a very silly point to make."
For what i'ts worth, I have read that the genetic background of Lebanese is indeed different than that of Arabs in other locales. More like Europeans - haplotypes maybe. That sort of thing. I am not a geneticist.
I can't get too anal about it. I'll take an "Arab" who is like Daniels ... or perhaps Paul Anka? than another "community organizer" type.
As a native of Indiana, I'm glad we've got Daniels here as a a governor. Indiana is in much better financial condition than most states. We have fewer state government employees now than we did thirty years ago and both state taxes and spending are under control. He may be open borders but we've got an Arizona type of illegal immigrant bill going through the legislature and he doesn't appear to be trying to stop it. As for him being president and making changes, I don't think he would be succesful. It's too late for this country to reverse the direction it's going in. So, if I were him, I would just stay governor.
@ I am a Swede, thanks for your comment. I knew Swedish elites were experiencing some pushback but not all these details. I look forward to Part 2.
He may be open borders but we've got an Arizona type of illegal immigrant bill going through the legislature and he doesn't appear to be trying to stop it.
He has refused to say if he'll sign it. He may just give it a "pocket veto" - ignore the bill until the end of this legislative session. I'll be very surprised if he actually signs that Arizona-style bill into law.
http://blogs.chron.com/texaspolitics/archives/2011/02/texas_demograph.html
Texas Abolishes Itself.
Peter Drucker once claimed it would be possible to convert business executives to be MDs (General Practitioners) with a couple months of specific training. He said that being a GP was mostly people skills with only a smattering of actual medical knowledge.
It seemed like a good suggestion except not for me thank you. I prefer my doctor to know a lot of medical stuff.
In any case it occurred to me that being the President of the United States wasn't such a hard job.
Let me be more bold - I think I could be a decent President. I could never get elected of course, but it doesn't seem like a particularly difficult job.
Many men burn out or crash in management jobs from the stress - but not Presidents. Maybe Gerald Ford was over his head but most of them cope just fine. Kennedy and Obama were both virtually without relevant experience and both screwed up early in their administrations but neither seemed to let their incompetance bother them.
When I was a manager my biggest problem was always getting people. I inherited bad ones and I spent most of my time searching for good replacements. But if you are the President you get your choice of the best people on earth. If you want someone you just call for him (or her) and they come.
Another problem in management are the enemies and rivals. But Presidents have partisans and operatives on their side. As President some of your people will literally lay down their lives for you. I would find that comforting.
If I as President didn't understand some issue I could have the world's leading expert in my office briefing me the next day. Or I could set an agency of ten thousand employees to look into it. Every corporate, union, non-profit or governmental executive has limits on his resources - except the President.
Finally America has a written constitution - a sort of instruction manual. Revolutionaries have to make everything up from scratch, but a President can let a lot of things just run on "automatic pilot".
So I don't buy this notion that it's the "hardest job on earth".
That means that Mitch Daniels should have little trouble being President - but so would Sarah Palin or any of the others.
Its their ideas that matter not their capacity for the job and I like Palin's ideas a lot more than I like those of Daniels.
Albertosaurus
"Everyone keeps saying that Republicans won't vote for an open borders, pro-business, blah blah blah candidate, but that just don't seem true. You're basically describing Ronald Reagan, and Reagan-worship is still alive and well."
Borders weren't as big an issue during the Reagan administration, because there were a lot fewer illegals here back then. Frankly, too, during a booming economy most people don't care who's busing the tables. Today is different. Rush Limbaugh, for example, is a big fan of Reagan, but he's also against illegal immigration.
"For what i'ts worth, I have read that the genetic background of Lebanese is indeed different than that of Arabs in other locales. More like Europeans - haplotypes maybe."
The Phoenicians were (Southern) Europeans, and founded city states in what is now Lebanon and elsewhere (including Gaza). Lebanese today likely have a mix of ancestries.
Two words: The Donald
...aka Donald Effing Trump III
Ronald Reagan would likely not be pro-immigration in 2011, knowing what we know now.
Daniels is the Elite-candidate, and his obfuscation on immigration is predictable. Recognize this rhetoric?
"I don’t think I know anyone that doesn’t want the law obeyed,” [Daniels] said.
“But these folks are vital for businesses. I’m hopeful the federal government will find a way to tighten borders and address the issue of citizenship...
“I’m all for people with hopes and dreams who want to come here and work, but I think they should have requirements. They need to be a good citizen, a contributing citizen. They need to learn English and pay taxes. “It ought not be under conditions of illegality.”"
"These people are here and are prepared to work hard,"
http://24ahead.com/indiana-gov-mitch-daniel-immigration-not-good-not-enough-inf
PS.
The overwhelming majority of Tea Party activists oppose illegal immigration passionately. They are out there taking the heat from the media. Only those who are not serious about immigration and America's future denigrate and look down on the Tea-Party on this issue.
Steve, I am glad that you did a post on Indiana.
Steve as you have often said, Los Angeles is no longer a good place for young white males whose IQ is not far far above average.
I mean, if you look at the young white males who grow up on your block in Studio City, those who happen to have IQ over 140 and a great work ethic can afford to raise a family in a truly desirable place like the Manhattan Beach Hills Section, or perhaps if their IQ is only 130 they can afford a still pretty nice place that is a little less expensive like La Canada or Hidden Hills.
but for the kids without IQ at those levels it is damn hard to afford a house in a nice part of LA with great public schools
(note that both Manhattan Beach and La Canada offer public high schools with almost no NAMs and thus that both high schools would be acceptable to almost all residents of the HBD blog universe)
Steve, for the young men who grow up on your block in Studio City and lack the IQ to get in to a desirable LA neighborhood I have long advocated that they move to Indianapolis.
My understanding is that you can buy a nice 4 bedroom house on a quarter acre in a nice part of Indianapolis for only $300 thousand dollars.
That same house would cost you about $4 million in Manhattan Beach, $3 million in Pacific Palisades, $2 million in La Canada.
So for the young man who lacks the IQ to buy it in LA, Indianapolis is a good choice.
As I offer advice to young men in California to move to Indianapolis, I invite fellow I steve readers who actually today live in Indianapolis to let me know if Indy really offers neighborhoods this nice that would appeal to the average Paleo conservative and also neighborhoods this nice that would appear to the average HBD conservative.
Or, am I giving Indy too much credit ?
(most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?).
I can.
...
Immigration and multi-culturalism are as American as apple pie.
No, multiculturalism* is not the American tradition. The melting pot and e pluribus unum are the American tradition.
////
* Would you classify the Confederate States of America as a form of American multiculturalism?
Borders weren't as big an issue during the Reagan administration, because there were a lot fewer illegals here back then. Frankly, too, during a booming economy most people don't care who's busing the tables.
Right. Conservatives have never really been all that concerned about immigration.
Obama got a lot of his ideas and inspiration from the leftist radical Saul Alinsky. So, it is only fitting that he should be called da SAUL MAN.
Someone should do a song parody.
The overwhelming majority of Tea Party activists oppose illegal immigration passionately. They are out there taking the heat from the media. Only those who are not serious about immigration and America's future denigrate and look down on the Tea-Party on this issue.
Evidence, please? I see enormous support for diversity nuts like Glenn Beck among the Tea Party types, and stuff like illegal immigrants speaking in front of Tea Party rallies.
I am getting sick and tired of seeing the name of these liberal Republicans being thrown around as potential nominees for 2012....
Since there are almost no conservative Republican officials, what do you expect?
I am getting sick and tired of seeing the name of these liberal Republicans being thrown around as potential nominees for 2012
A Virginia Postrel book? Ugh.
"I mean, if you look at the young white males who grow up on your block in Studio City, those who happen to have IQ over 140 and a great work ethic..."
The whole group of them, huh?
When I was a manager my biggest problem was always getting people. I inherited bad ones and I spent most of my time searching for good replacements.
Interesting, then, that managers never try to find good employees.
Conservatives are funny. The establishment types always betray them and sell them out but they just can't help themselves. Mitch is so "adult" and "responsible". Deep down they always want Jerry Ford back.
But why complain, they'll never change. They voted for McCain in 2008, "Mr. Amnesty" himself. They voted for JOrge Bush in 2000 and 2004, 'cause Gore would've been so "evil". They voted for Dole in '96 and Bush I in '92.
So yeah, it'll be Mitch or Mitt in 2012, and if they're elected, the conservatives will be whining and moaning in 2013.
Christian Levantines are entreprenuerial, very verbal, and good at dealmaking. They have a long history of trading and commerce, going back to the time of the Phoenicians. They've done pretty well in the U.S. and more especially Latin America and Carribean. Quite a few succeeded very well as businessmen, like Carlos Slim of Mexico. Others have done well in politics or entertainment. Lots of them are working on Wall Street.
The downside is that, as Middle Easterners, they tend to be clannish and unethical. Past generations may have assimilated, as immigration was cut off and there was strong pressure to Americanize, but I'm not so sure about the current waves of immigrants. Even the business ventures they're involved with tend not to create value, but rather distribute existing value to themselves. They're more involved in the financier and wheeler/dealer type stuff, rather than building from the ground up. More Carlos Slim than Henry Ford. I don't think their mean IQ is anything impressive, but they've got the dealmaker mindset.
Tony Rezko is Levantine Christian (Syrian). A good example of what they're like when not that assimilated.
I think the bulk of them have gotten out of Syria and Lebanon for greener pastures in the US, Carribean, Latin America, and Australia. At this point, I'd be skeptical if there are many enterprising people left over there.
Lebanese Muslims seem to, by the standards of the Mid East, be fairly entreprenuerial too. Lots of them trade in Africa and use their money to finance Hezbollah. They aren't nearly as successful as the Christians either at home or abroad (ask any Australian about Lebanese Christians v.s. Lebanese Muslim immigrants).
Seems like a lot of other
groups from this region (Syrian Jews, Persian Jews, Armenians, Bukarian Jews) do well at the same stuff as Lebanese Christians, but aren't super intellectual either. I think all those groups probably found economic niches in different areas (Lebanese and Syrian Jews in the Levant, Armenians in the Turkish sections of the Ottoman Empire, Bukharians in Central Asia, Persian Jews in Iran), selecting them for commercial and trading abilities. However, living in societies where the mean IQ was 85ish, maybe the IQ selection wasn't that strong. As propserous as those groups tend to be through business, it's rare to seem them succeed in the sciences or academic pursuits.
These groups tend to be ostentatious too. Just check out the Persian Palaces of Los Angeles or the Bukharian mansions in Greenwich.
"Two words: The Donald"
There is only one thing that would cause candidate Donald to tell them to "Get out and get out now."
If we could somehow promise him that in exchange for kicking them out and keeping them out, we'd put his name on---the Statue of Libery (Trump Liberty Tower); at least three classic golf courses (Trump's Cypress, Trump at Pinehurst, Trump's Beach at Pebble); if we re-named Vegas "DonaldWorld" (or maybe we'd have to name the whole state of Nevada after him) ; at least one movie studio--Universal, it's the biggest, isn't it, and call it OmniTrump; and the new Cowboys' Stadium in Dallas just has to be re-named in honor of our red-haired fat boy: Trump Stadium, Dallas (because after he got this one, he'd want another, like Trump Stadium, the Meadowlands.)
Then, and only then, might he consider doing what needs to be done.
My understanding is that you can buy a nice 4 bedroom house on a quarter acre in a nice part of Indianapolis for only $300 thousand dollars.
Indianapolis? You can buy a nice four-bedroom house on four-tenths of an acre in a nice part of Dallas for $270,000.
"Agreed. I'd rather live in socialist white homogeneous Sweden than in a libertarian multiracial Brazil or India.
Sweden isn't really socialist. They have business and marekts just like we do. We have many gov't programs like they do,but they are still mostly white, even though they have had some immigration. I hope they cut off immigration.
"evidence please"
http://pewresearch.org/pubs/1904/poll-illegal-immigration-border-security-path-to-citizenship--birthright-citizenship-arizona-law
"The strongest level of support for amending the Constitution is among Tea Party supporters, 57% of whom favor changing the constitution to eliminate birthright citizenship (38% oppose such a change)."
91% of Tea Partiers support Arizona's law.
Incidentally, Glen Beck is extremely strong on illegal immigration. His "diversity" enthusiasm is supporting pro Martin Luther King, which I don't have any problem with.
I myself have no use for his conspiracy theories. However it is sad that you accept the leftist smears of Glen Beck, even though he is one of the few pundits who fights for your cause. Others here are attacking the Tea Party and conservatives, which is similarly counterproductive.
In a country where 90% of the media and the elites are against us, what is better, accepting the few allies we have, or agreeing to dislike those who the leftist media command us to dislike?
Incidentally, Glen Beck is extremely strong on illegal immigration.
No way. His opposition to *illegal* immigration is always qualified by supporting an increase in legal immigration. The same is true for conservatives generally. Conservatives *never* oppose legal immigration.
Beck is not only strong on illegal immigration and a supporter of the Arizona law, he is even against birthright citizenship.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/jun/19/glenn-beck/glenn-beck-claims-us-only-country-automatic-citize/
Paying lip service to legal immigration at the end of a rant against illegal immigration hardly proves he is a softy.
What exactly do you demand? That he reads aloud from chapters 13 and 14 of the Bell Curve on air?
Either you are purist, in which case no-one will satisfy you, or you are just biased against Glen Beck.
A commenter at the Texas Abolishes Itself story nails it:
"Contraception has turned Anglos into an endangered species. It is terribly destructive. Fifty years ago it was against the law. Back then, Anglos had children, and we didn't have an illegal immigrant problem."
Just remember that, dudes, when you're telling the GF how you're not ready for commitment, or the wife that you don't want any more kids, or the mistress to *get rid of it*.
We have it coming.
"Your memory is short."
So is yours.
"Tancredo was also running and he was even more of a hardliner than Huckabee."
Did he get 1% or 2% of the vote?
"Maybe you only tuned in after Tom dropped out?"
No, but he quit before I could vote for him. I noticed Huckabee refused to drop out when the RINO's wanted to get rid of him.
He would have done better if the primaries didn't start in New England.
Texas should assert itself and announce that it will be going first in 2012. Let the little girls scream.
You guys are missing the point on the usefulness of Huckabee. You need a guy running who is promising to build the fence, if for nothing else to keep bringing up the issue.
"Or, am I giving Indy too much credit?"
There's a reason why real estate prices mirror location. Indy real estate hasn't gone up in 2 generations. Why?
Snuffy Smith, Bobby Knight, and AJ Foyt culture.
Dead geography. Flatland, corn, corn, corn, and a very user-unfriendly river.
Everyone who is anyone has left.
Frozen in the 50s mentality and no sign of updating soon.
"There is only one thing that would cause candidate Donald to tell them to "Get out and get out now.
[put his name on a bunch of buildings and statues]
Then, and only then, might he consider doing what needs to be done."
I call it a fine trade.
Get rid of the invaders, put our hero's name on some buildings. The problem is?
Where do I sign the agreement?
What an ugly little twerp.
Re Sweden and its immigration policy:
Sweden and its Liberal Migration Tenets
Apparently, the pushback by some Swedes against their nation's loberal immigration policy is strong and persistent enough that the NYT can no longer ignore it.
Being against all immigration -- even legal immigration -- is counter-productive and stupid.
The challenge is to change legal immigration to accept only intelligent, educated, skilled, and loyal immigrants eager to assimilate.
If you are against even that type of legal immigration, then you need to dig a deep hole, jump in, then cover yourself with the loose dirt.
"My understanding is that you can buy a nice 4 bedroom house on a quarter acre in a nice part of Indianapolis for only $300 thousand dollars."
I bought a (fairly) nice 4 bedroom, three-bath home in the suburbs of Fort Worth for $128,000. The lots are no-where near a quarter acre and the subdivision has a lot of cookie cutter homes by the same (very competent) builder, but I don't think you can get a better deal for the money anywhere in the country. The neighborhood is also about 95% white and far removed from more vibrant communities.
(most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?)."
Mine goes back on my father's side to 1635, Connecticut. On his French and Spanish line, 1700 (earlier if you consider that they came from Quebec.). hhe New Enland families had huge numbers and most seem to have survived in the 17th and 18th centuries. So there are millions like me; not that rare.
most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?
(I answer this here once every couple years or so).
I can, too. I looked it up many years ago, so I can't remember exactly how far back they go, but it's well before 1776; might even be pre-18th century.
Back in those days, they didn't have pressure-treated, kiln-dried, uniform-sized 4x8 plywood. All they had was a lot of logs and boards of various sizes. Some were good; others not so good. The carpenter had to choose, and he had to know the difference between good timber and bad.
You still have to be choosy, with 2x4s. LOTS of crap in the pile. I'd say 1 in 10 is straight, maybe? 'Course that's the shit at the big stores, maybe real lumber suppliers are better.
Immigration and multi-culturalism are as American as apple pie.
So are slavery, segregation, populism, violent revolution, self-determination, freedom of association, etc.
So I don't buy this notion that it's the "hardest job on earth".
I enjoyed your post, but, erm, who does buy that notion? It's PR bullshit.
Its their ideas that matter not their capacity for the job and I like Palin's ideas a lot more than I like those of Daniels.
Albertosaurus
The hardest part of becoming president is surviving the media gauntlet, something Palin would have a really hard time doing IMO. The media class simply won't have her.
His "diversity" enthusiasm is supporting pro Martin Luther King, which I don't have any problem with.
I don't follow Beck, but assuming that's true, the people who criticize his "diversity" worship are 'tards. Using MLK is a good idea. Not good enough to make it a universal, but still a good idea.
In fact, it's pretty delicious. MLK today would probably be all for quotas, AA, and "get whitey." But there is no MLK today. All the left has is saint MLK from the 60s, preserved in amber. And that MLK, the real MLK, championed color-blindness, equality of opportunity (not outcomes), etc; quite the opposite of what the 'bamster and the rest champion.
Why leave that weapon lying on the field? It's begging to be used. That MLK is a saint of the left is what makes it so perfect; do you think anything drives a leftist crazier than someone like Beck using MLK for his own purposes? I don't. Talk about who-whom heresy.
"MLK today would probably be all for quotas, AA, and "get whitey." But there is no MLK today. All the left has is saint MLK from the 60s, preserved in amber. And that MLK, the real MLK, championed color-blindness, equality of opportunity (not outcomes), etc; quite the opposite of what the 'bamster and the rest champion."
MLK started out advocating for black self-sufficiency and colorblindness but toward the end of his life he began advocating more AA/leftist policies. It's true, though, that most Americans don't know about that last part.
most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?
I can. I have an ancestor who came over on the Mayflower.
Problem is that identity has been multi-cultural from very early on. In the 18th century you got the British-Scots complaining about how the Germans wouldn't assimilate. In the mid-19th, the Irish came aboard. Then in the late 19th/early 20th a whole host of Southern and Eastern Europeans ranging from Sicilians to Ukranians to Poles to Jews who were inarguably very distant from the northwestern European cultural origins of the country.
Meh. You can claim that every country on Earth is multi-cultural using that sort of argument. I mean, England had Celts, and then they mixed with Anglo-Saxons, and Danes, and Normans. (And Irish, though that's a sore point around here) So really, if you squint just right, you can argue that today's Caribbean and Pakistani immigrants are just a continuation of England's multicultural past. Right?
If you move out to Dallas or Fort Worth or Houston, you're basically living in Tex-Mex country. I'm not criticizing that, but I doubt many people here would be comfortable with living in northern Mexico.
Anglos are only 1/3 of all births in Texas now. One reason is that buying a house is so affordable that a lot of immigrants and illegals settle down. In such an area, it's probably impossible to find a school anywhere below at least 1/4th NAM.
A lot of Texas Mexicans are 3rd/4th/5th generation types, so maybe that sort of makes the situation better in a way.
"Prolly meant "not very much like other Arabs" / "atypical among Arabs" ... probably since their culture has been guided by a different way of thinking about the world, for centuries."
And that's where most Americans making this point are wrong. Their knowledge of Arabs is very limited and has no experience dealing with Arabs in their own lands; their experience is mostly limited to highly assimilated Christian Arab-Americans. In other words people who culturally are barely "Arab" at all anymore.
Christian Arabs in the middle east are very different from assimilated Arab-American Christians. Most of the problems inherent in Arab or Middle Eastern culture were/are present in Christian Arab culture, and Islam itself grew out of and in many ways is a culmination of middle eastern Christian culture.
My favorite anecdote on this point would be a story that the War Nerd mentioned once of rival Christian Lebanese war lords; one of them got the drop on the other at a beach party (for some reason volleyball was involved IIRC - no doubt I am misremembering details) and proceeded to rape the females in front of their parents before torturing everyone on the losing side to death. Remember this was Christian-on-Christian violence, none of those nasty Moslems were involved.
Arab Christians actually living in the middle east are every bit as pushy, violent, exclusivist, tribal, etc as Arab Muslims are. The Christians being a richer, probably more intelligent minority have avoided some of the nastier tendencies of the hoi polloi Arab Muslims, but you should not go too far in making that distinction. Islam took a lot of the bad tendencies inherent in Christianity to their logical conclusion. Middle Eastern Christianity is not the same thing as Western Christianity.
Arabic (and in general Middle Eastern) cultural tendencies are shared across the sectarian divide; people make far too much of these religious differences and ignore the power of a common culture to unite these diverse religious groups which share many cultural traits, some positive some negative, in spite of their religious differences. It is the cultural similarities that they aren't even aware of that are the most powerful.
Texas should assert itself and announce that it will be going first in 2012. Let the little girls scream.
Um, no. The DNC and RNC both penalize states who try to schedule their primaries early.
I'm not sure how to interpret the news that in Fort Worth a four bedroom house in an all white neighborhood can be purchased for under $200 thousand.
The issue on the table is, a house on a quarter acre in a "no nam" neighborhood of los angeles costs $1, $2, $3 million.
As per the bell curve, income correlates to IQ. Those without the IQ to be able to afford such a house need to leave Los Angeles.
We all understand affordable family formation. If you don't have the IQ the family formation is not affordable in LA
People here speak disparagingly of Indy. So for paleo conservative young whites who can't afford an all white neighborhood of los angeles, where should they move?
Indy, or some other place
Here to straighten you out!
1) this was a mult-ethnic country w/ a dominant, established European Christian culture, largely Protestant at that
2) immigration numbers should have everything to do w/ the needs of the existing population, maybe you need low skilled workers b/c those jobs are going unfilled, maybe highly skilled the next decade - it ain't all one or the other or always the same all the time, so there!
3) svigor needs to take an asprin, seems to have a hangover, & yes it takes one to know one
4) though I am mad, mad, mad, mad, mad at meddling Jews, Lieberman is still way cuter than Daniels
You geniuses really can't be left alone too long can you?
Being against all immigration -- even legal immigration -- is counter-productive and stupid.
No.
The challenge is to change legal immigration to accept only intelligent, educated, skilled, and loyal immigrants eager to assimilate.
Mutation rather than reproduction usually has negative consequences. Why should we choose to mutate (by assimilating immigrants) when our current genotype has long given us what we need socially, economically, and technologically?
If you are against even that type of legal immigration, then you need to dig a deep hole, jump in, then cover yourself with the loose dirt.
Because you say so? That's not much of an argument.
@Svigor..You are aware that the internet exists,right?!
"The challenge is to change legal immigration to accept only intelligent, educated, skilled, and loyal immigrants eager to assimilate'
Why? We can produce our own people;we don't need to import them. We had almost no immigration for over 40 years until the late 60's. We did ok.
Straightening you out some more:
6) birth control was never illegal it just didn't exist yet
7) yes, it's all too easy to focus on the quality of your life at the expense of procreation but we can make a conscious decision to shift resources to young adults who want children but don't want to be miserable while young
8) abortion has always existed whether legal or not same as euthanasia: though brutal, abortion is not the crux of the matter, fear of poverty as well as the stigma of being a mom & wife without some evidence that you can thrive in a man's world has much to do with it, as well as the lack of a living wage for 20 something males
9) I see a lot of fatalism on this blog which annoys me. We aren't dead or beaten yet but might as well be from the comments suggesting "we're all doomed!"
Solutions are everywhere, some of them so simple it boggles the mind. I think we're killing ourselves with fears & very narrow ideas of what it takes to be successful or worthwhile in this world. Tell your children that becoming adults around age 18 is more important than postponing your life for nearly a decade more to be something really, really special. That will go a long way towards fixing the baby bust in the white population. Maybe you can have it all but you don't necessarily have to do it 5 to 10 years out of high school. The mindless repetition of subjects in high school & the first 2 years of college is another factor though I believe many school districts are getting capable juniors & seniors college credits nowadays.
Also, you can always have some kind of economy, be it barter & trade or otherwise. There is something of value you can trade with someone who has something different from you. In theory & I believe in practice, we could have little utopias (& dystopias ) pop up independently all over this country. It sounds a little like anarchy but if no one overreacted to the process it might be a peaceful transition to more purposeful lives.
I bet most of the posters here had their ancestors come to America much more recently than the typical African-American did (most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?)
I'm some southern mix of Scots-Irish, English, Scottish, maybe Welsh, a smidge of Choctaw. From the little I know about it all, I'd be very surprised if any of my ancestors came here after 1800. That means they probably came pre-Revolution, since I've read emmigration out of Britain stopped in that period. I'm sure many of the posters/readers here could say the same, whatever part of the country they come from.
If I were a betting man, I'd guess you must be an ethnic white from the northeast. You all seem to have those nostaligic stories about old Uncle Giuseppe or Moishe coming through Ellis Island c. 1903 and all that. So you assume everyone else does too.
"most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?"
Well, half of mine were here before the early 1700s or before- amongst the first settlers of New Orleans, Jamestown, Charleston, and the Appalachain "backcountry." The others all came over in the mid-19th century. Ironically I have to admit I associate more with the recent ones. But I think most white Americans do have some colonial ancestry- it may not constitute all of their family tree but it constitutes a significant percentage.
So are slavery, segregation, populism, violent revolution, self-determination, freedom of association, etc.
My bad; I forgot white supremacy and white nationalism.
"I can. I have an ancestor who came over on the Mayflower."
And I was there in Hershey, PA, the night Wilt scored 100 points.
"MLK today would probably be all for quotas,"
You've had a seance lately?
If Daniels could make it past the base, he could definitely win the general election. But I don't think he'll make it past the base, so it's a moot point.
I actually doubt he's planning to run, as that would explain why such a smart guy seems to have gone out of his way to convince the base that he's a RINO.
Pawlenty is doing the opposite; he is clearly planning on running.
"most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?."
Most of my ancestors came here from Italy during the early 20th century. I did, however, trace the German line of my heritage back to a man living in an insane asylum in New Jersey in the late 1700s. That was an unwelcome find.
And I was there in Hershey, PA, the night Wilt scored 100 points.
You're easily the most useless commenter on this site, or in fact anywhere on the web.
Do you have anything to say on any topic other than witless half-assed attempts at snark?
3) svigor needs to take an asprin, seems to have a hangover, & yes it takes one to know one
Close...kinda. Not a bad guess, actually.
"I can. I have an ancestor who came over on the Mayflower."
And I was there in Hershey, PA, the night Wilt scored 100 points.
And you had nothing to say about the comment that elicited all the ancestral bona fides comments...because you're a black nationalist (or what passes for one, anyway).
You've had a seance lately?
As far as you're concerned, yes, I had a seance with MLK recently.
You've had a seance lately?
I'm not sure what's more disturbing - that Troot thought that this attempt at witticism deserved to see the light of day, or that Steve (the moderator) though it did as well.
2) immigration numbers should have everything to do w/ the needs of the existing population, maybe you need low skilled workers b/c those jobs are going unfilled
Thanks for that crash course in Marxist thinking. In a free market system, jobs going unfilled is the market signal to either (1) pay more or (2) do away with that job entirely.
(most black Americans have ancestry in the U.S. going back to the 18th century...how many posters here can say the same?)."
1636, Braintree, Mass.
"Anglos are only 1/3 of all births in Texas now. One reason is that buying a house is so affordable that a lot of immigrants and illegals settle down. In such an area, it's probably impossible to find a school anywhere below at least 1/4th NAM."
It's not even hard to find a low NAM school in the Houston area.
Clements HS 44% white 43% Asian 7% hispanic, 6% black.
Allen HS (Dallas suburb)
68% white
12% black
11% hispanic
8% Asian
This just in:
Texas group to offer college scholarships to white men
By Jim Forsyth
SAN ANTONIO, Tex. | Sat Feb 26, 2011 1:44pm EST
SAN ANTONIO, Tex. (Reuters) - Members of a new Texas association are starting a college scholarship program for a group of students they say do not have as many scholarship options as others -- white men.
Friends of yours, Sailer?
"I can. I have an ancestor who came over on the Mayflower."
And I was there in Hershey, PA, the night Wilt scored 100 points.
Huh? Supposedly like 10% of the country has an ancestor who came over on the Mayflower.
Instead of focusing on elections, white conservatives need to focus on erections. If every white conservative male pledges to have at least 4 kids, the white race may be saved.
Elections are lost and won, but people are here to stay.
More than a president-elect, we need a population-erect. And we don't need all white people to do this. Only white conservative males. And if they can't find a white woman to go along, they should find a hispanic chick or asian chick. Half-asian/half-whites often can pass as whites. Also, if most hispanics are half-white, a child of a white and a hispanic wil be 3/4 white, which is better than nuttin.
"It's not even hard to find a low NAM school in the Houston area."
In my experience, it will be whole districts that tend to be NAM. Those will break down further into black vs hispanic districts. I imagine the Katy school district has the most Asians at least from decades long settlement patterns not to mention areas more recently developed south of downtown. I remember being shocked at a field full of what appeared to be Vietnamese playing soccer at one of the high schools there.
You will find odd majority minority populations in unexpected places in the suburbs as well. A majority white district can have a few majority NAM schools.
We would almost end up with something like provinces if the NAM weren't so aggressive in dominating what's left of the white majority areas to the north and east. I guess this is eventually how it will play out sans the inclusion of any white dominant areas.
"Do you have anything to say on any topic other than witless half-assed attempts at snark?"
Oh, be fair. I do occasionally offer unfunny, hurtful and malignant insults as well.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mayflower_passengers_who_died_in_the_winter_of_1620%E2%80%931621
There were 102 passengers on the Mayflower and 45 died before the first winter ended. There were 18 women on the ship and 14 were dead within 4 months.
From what I can infer from this, even in the infinitesimally small chance that you are a Mayflower Yankee, you might not want to admit it there, Geronimo.
@Kylie:
That does not say he was pro quota, it says he had taken division in school.
Severn on Truth:
"Do you have anything to say on any topic other than witless half-assed attempts at snark?"
I find Truth's comments funny and on point. "Snarky" to you, "biting" to me.
OTOH, your commentary is groundless, bitter, deeply biased, and lacking real substance. Just saying.
"There were 102 passengers on the Mayflower and 45 died before the first winter ended. There were 18 women on the ship and 14 were dead within 4 months.
"From what I can infer from this, even in the infinitesimally small chance that you are a Mayflower Yankee, you might not want to admit it there, Geronimo."
More ships came, you know. The Mayflower was not the last. The guys who survived could always marry the women who came later. They lacked the modern perverse aversion to marrying lovely young virgins. There are extensive records of the Massachusetts colonists. They had lots of kids, who had lots of kids etc. Their kids then married those who came later and their kids married newer newcomers etc. It isn't too hard to imagine that they could be related to half the USA. They weren't just marrying their cousins like some cultures do.
OTOH, your commentary is groundless, bitter, deeply biased, and lacking real substance. Just saying.
And when Anonymous speaks, people listen.
I do occasionally offer unfunny, hurtful and malignant insults as well.
No, I'm afraid that you are as inept with insults as you are at being sarcastic.
Supposedly like 10% of the country has an ancestor who came over on the Mayflower.
That's correct. There are about 30 millions Americans today who can trace their ancestry back to the Mayflower.
Even Troot might be one of them.
Levantine Christians tend to occupy the same niches as Jews, but with less prejudice against them, perhaps because they tried harder to fit in. Every Oklahoma small town had at least one clothing or grocery store run by a Lebanese. It was as universal as the present connection between Motel and Patel.
They also made a mark as designers. John Najjar designed the Mustang for Ford, and Richard Arbib was a major competitor to Raymond Loewy in industrial and auto design.
There were 102 passengers on the Mayflower and 45 died before the first winter ended. There were 18 women on the ship and 14 were dead within 4 months.
From what I can infer from this, even in the infinitesimally small chance that you are a Mayflower Yankee, you might not want to admit it there, Geronimo.
I wrote "an ancestor", not "all of one's ancestors", moron. Obviously nobody alive today is 100% descended from Mayflower passengers.
"Then it is logical to assume..."
assume
- 4 dictionary results
as·sume
/əˈsum/ Show Spelled [uh-soom] Show IPA verb, -sumed, -sum·ing.
–verb (used with object)
1.
to take for granted or without proof; suppose; postulate; posit: to assume that everyone wants peace.
I have an ancestor who came over on the Mayflower.
I'm* descended from Mary Chilton, the first European to set foot on Plymouth Rock.
BTW, the Plymouth landing was also painted by Henry Sargent, who is a "cousin" of mine [we're all descended from Epes Sargent "Sr"].
Which, among other things, means that John Singer Sargent is also a "cousin".
And I have numerous ancestors - as well as "cousins", "aunts", and "uncles" - who were painted by Copley.
Plus an ancestor who wrote the Harvard charter, ancestors who were Presidents of Harvard, etc etc etc.
*My brother also lurks here at iSteve, so that makes at least two of us in these lines.
Is Truth a white nationalist trying to reinforce negative stereotypes of blacks?
Allen HS is about 1/4th NAM. Clements HS is about 15 percent NAM and I bet it'll increase quickly as time goes along. Clements is also about 1/2 Asian too.
Maybe I should say this..... It's hard to find an overwhelmingly white school in Texas these days. Either you've got lots of NAMs or, if you have money to live in an expensive area, lots of Asians. A lot of the few remaining white majority areas are demographically changing at a rapid rate too.
People have this idea of Texas as some conservative, real American type state. - unlike lefty and multicultural-obsessed California. Wrong. Texas is in the same situation as California with respect to immigration and demographics. It's lucky enough to have a confident conservative white population that dominates politics and keeps government small. It's also got a more assimilated Texican population. Even there, however, the writing is on the wall. When minorities are 55 percent of the population and 2/3 of all births, you've got a tough situation.
People forget that California was a conservative state that produced Reagan, Goldwater, Nixon, Pete Wilson, and a lot of other conservative/Republican leaders. Then it was hit by a huge wave of illegal immigration from the early 1980s onward. A lot of those illegals got amnesty in 1986, brought over their wives and relatives, had a lot of kids (Hispanic fertility rose to almost 5 children per woman during that time). Their kids then proceeded to have a lot of kids too. At the same time, a lot of white middle class conservatives got tired of the growing welfare state neccessary to take care of the growing Mexican population, higher taxes, overcrowding, deteriorating schools, etc. and got out.
You think that can't happen in Texas?
@Truth,
"If a city has a 30% Negro population, then it is logical to assume that Negroes should have at least 30% of the jobs in any particular company, and jobs in all categories rather than only in menial areas."
Should have, not would have. That makes it imperative rather than predictive, and that makes it a quota. Also, he specifies that those jobs "should" be in all categories, not just menial. Again, he is outlining not what he thinks would happen but what he thinks should happen.
Clever of him to slip in that "logical to assume", though. Makes it all sound so reasonable, which of course, makes any opposition to it sound unreasonable.
"Is Truth a white nationalist trying to reinforce negative stereotypes of blacks?"
Nah, Bro, just a guy who can read.
"Clever of him to slip in that "logical to assume", though. Makes it all sound so reasonable, which of course, makes any opposition to it sound unreasonable."
Yeah, that MLK was a diabolical genius.
I am fifth cousin to Harriet Beecher Stowe and something like a seventh cousin to John Wesley Harding and Aaron Burr. I don't think the latter is supposed to be good.
Lot's of people have had ancestors who came over in the 1600s. These families were prolific. Even if one side of your family came in at Ellis Island in 1909, it's not improbable that another thread traces back much earlier.
I am curious what the percentages are of people who are descended from people who came here in the 17th century. I was surprised to find that huge numbers of people in New Jersey and Delaware (of all places) trace their ancestry to Scandinavians who came there in the mid-1600s.
"Anonymous said...
I find Truth's comments funny and on point. "Snarky" to you, "biting" to me."
Are you aware that "Truth" believes that there are cars that run on water? "Truth"'s beliefs amount to a collection of half-assed conspiracy theories of the sort that were considered by the writers of "The X Files" and discarded as too improbable. His so-called knowledge is gleaned from the moldy crevices of the internet. I'd wager that he seldom reads actual books.
He's a cretin who aspires to be an idiot.
"Yeah, that MLK was a diabolical genius."
No, just more verbally adept than you are.
Yes, I realize that might look like genius to you.
And don't think I didn't notice you abandoned your futile efforts at refuting my argument and resorted to sniping at my own word usage.
Nice try, though. Have a Pez.
"Is Truth a white nationalist trying to reinforce negative stereotypes of blacks?"
Nah, Bro, just a guy who can read.
So it's more of a cognitive rather than reading limitation?
Reading, understanding and thinking are distinct and progressively more difficult tasks. You're almost half-way there.
The unfounded swagger and snark are mostly harmless as long as you're not cutting open people or designing load-bearing structures.
"And don't think I didn't notice you abandoned your futile efforts at refuting my argument"
There's only so much "refuting" before it gets to the 'nah-nah-ni-nah-nah' stage.
"The unfounded swagger and snark are mostly harmless as long as you're not cutting open people or designing load-bearing structures."
You've got to be kidding me! I'm a civil engineer who moonlights as a heart surgeon!
"If a city has a 30% Negro population, then it is logical to assume that Negroes should have at least 30% of the jobs in any particular company, and jobs in all categories rather than only in menial areas."
That's Trootian logic for you!
In 1930s, remarriages were the favorite happy endings to screwball comedies, but they usually strike me as evidence of interesting internal passions not wholly consistent with his image of chipper blandness.
Or evidence that his wife suffered from the boredom and inanition common past a certain age, responded in a way common among American women, and later thought better of it. Supposedly, she ditched him and their four children and moved out to California and married a doctor.
"You've got to be kidding me! I'm a civil engineer who moonlights as a heart surgeon!"
I'll rethink my vacation plans.
"There's only so much 'refuting' before it gets to the 'nah-nah-ni-nah-nah' stage."
Or in your case, the 'blah-blah-blah' stage--and right off the bat.
I'll let you in a little secret. When I repeatedly reply to your more inane assertions, it's not actually in response to you but for the amusement of third parties reading this thread.
Other times, I can't be bothered and I just let the inanity stand.
In this instance of your kneejerk defense of my least favorite serial plagiarist/adulterer, I just didn't feel like letting it stand.
"In this instance of your kneejerk defense of my least favorite serial plagiarist/adulterer, I just didn't feel like letting it stand."
I didn't "defend" MLK, I just wondered why Svigor was projecting upon a man who has been dead for over 40 years.
And if adultery were the serious issue to you, you'd hate practicaly every rich/ famous white man in America. You watch the news.
From the MLK quote, I get that he expected that the fraction of blacks in the population and in city jobs would end up the same. But I don't see anything that says he would (or wouldn't) have supported quotas. That wouldn't have been a surprising outcome, but I don't get it from that quote.
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