Paper Tigers
What happens to all the Asian-American overachievers when the test-taking ends?
By Wesley Yang
(The illustration is not from the article, but from the sadly missed Bitter Asian Men website of yore.)
Yang complains that while years of test prep help East Asian guys get prestigious credentials, then after schooling they're not getting enough blondes and CEO jobs. He recommends, reasonably, that Asian guys study Game and other self-help techniques. (The Successful White American Executive / Salesman personality that Yang envies was honed by generations of self-improvement efforts, from Ben Franklin's Autobiography and Ralph Waldo Emerson's lecture tours through Dale Carnegie's How to Win Friends and Influence People.)
Yang concludes:
And though the debate [Amy Chua] sparked about Asian-American life has been of questionable value, we will need more people with the same kind of defiance, willing to push themselves into the spotlight and to make some noise, to beat people up, to seduce women, to make mistakes, to become entrepreneurs, to stop doggedly pursuing official paper emblems attesting to their worthiness, to stop thinking those scraps of paper will secure anyone’s happiness, and to dare to be interesting.
Okay, there are a lot of interesting suggestions here. Yet, in an article on racial conflict in a national magazine, could we go a little easier on the "beat people up" recommendation? I realize this New York Magazine article is suggesting beating up only white people, not anybody who isn't supposed to get beaten up, so that's okay. But, still ...
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126 comments:
I'm sure they didn't mean "beat [people in general] up". Acceptable targets are assumed.
there will never be Asian male solidarity for the simple reason that Asian males don't even like each other.
How can the Right best exploit Bitter Asian Men for political gain? I know it's a cold thing to say, but the other side thinks this way all the time.
Are they more likely to become haters of White people and traditional America because of these feelings? I can see that.
Asian boys were drilled into betadom their entire upbringing, its hard to deprogram.
Here's a heartfelt response to the NY mag piece from the highly credentialed author of the "Ask a Korean" blog. Correctly pointing out that the vast majority of people who really try to radically "rebel" wind up making themselves and their families miserable. And that most great innovators and artists in fact have a lot in common with the dogged credentialists, especially as regards work ethic.
http://askakorean.blogspot.com/2011/05/why-you-should-never-listen-to-asian.html
There are not enough prestige, high paying jobs for all the high scoring test takers! A revolution of some sorts will take place in the future but only if there is group cohesion.
I think Asian men should take Whiskey's advice and 'thug it up.' Just like this guy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cmr1c1mT8RY
High IQ is more likely to repel women than attract them. No attractive girl cares about your advanced engineering degree. What they care about is social status, confidence and the aura of a bad boy.
Off topic alert!
Goy is spamming his blog!
Incidentally, where is the Dominique Strauss-Kahn article on this website?
We have a "youuuuu buuuuuy, meee seeeeeeell, you liiiiiike" Mediterranean Jew, with his bud Ramzi Khiroun, vs. the Fulani woman from West African nation of Guinea.
For f**k's sake, Steve-o, just google Fulani woman on google images - some of these women are stunning (yes, I am into the exotic).
http://americangoy.blogspot.com/2011/05/wheres-maid.html
Geez, and all this time I thought race was just a social construct.
Yeah yeah right, Asian men ought to stop bothering with paper symbols and audition for porn and tryout for NFL and NBA. They'll make it!! It's all in the bravura effort.
BITTER TOMORROW the movie.
"Sometimes I’ll glimpse my reflection in a window and feel astonished by what I see. Jet-black hair. Slanted eyes. A pancake-flat surface of yellow-and-green-toned skin."
Something tells me that what's really bothering him is not his face but the reflection of an organ further down on his body.
"in an article on racial conflict in a national magazine, could we go a little easier on the "beat people up" recommendation? I'm just saying' ..."
Come on Steve, he is obviously referring to black gang bangers who are the rivals of Asian gangs.
The 'beat people up' recommendation has a solid objective basis.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/why-women-really-do-love-selfobsessed-psychopaths-850007.html
This is a blog written by a bitter white man anxious about the declining place of white males. He has plenty of bitter white male supporters who are dishonest about masculinity.
There is no Asian-white racial gap when it comes to intermarriage. There is a cultural gap. American born Asians of both genders intermarry at the same rates. This is apparent based on how Japanese American men marry white women at the same rate Japanese American women do.
Statistics for marriages in 2008: 41.7% of US-born Asian American men marry outside compared to 50.8% of US-born Asian American women marrying outside.
Source: http://pewsocialtrends.org/files/2010/10/755-marrying-out.pdf
I also notice black male/white female relationships tend to be viewed as the products of coercion. Black men are always described as aggressive harassers of white women rather than charmers.
It comes down to how thoroughly beta this blog is. Many white men here are losers and need to inflate some fantasy of white male status.
It's too bad for them, there are just not many Asian dudes who are physical specimens, and as a consequence they lack self confidence. There is one native born Asian-American player in the NBA, and he is apparently the first one in 50 years and he is a bench warmer on Golden State and I believe one in the entire NFL and he is a backup OT for Buffalo. That's not many considering how many East Asians are in the US, particularly if you consider how many Polynesian guys play in the NFL despite the fact that the combined Polynesian populations in the US are much smaller than even some Asian groups considered separately.
The NBA is 10% white American which is pretty low.
Of course, the whole Tiger Mom thing might work if your children are girls, but if you have sons you'll just end up castrating them.
If Amy Chua had sons, they'd be well on their way to 40 year old virgin status.
Just out of curiosity:
Asians tend to get annoyed when you can't tell Chinese, Japanese and Korean people apart.
However, in the early 20th Century anti-Korean pogroms in Japan many native Japanese were lynched after being mistaken for Koreans.
Does this mean that Asians also can't tell each other apart?
Hey, the Asian community has its own Philip Roth(albeit without the humor).
BOK CHOY'S COMPLAINT.
After Amy Chua the Tiger Mom, we get Wesley Yang the Pussy Boy. He should stop whining. Decades ago, his kind were starving and getting bayoneted by crazy Japanese. And millions are still starving in North Korea.
Anti-Gnostic said...
My initial impression is that white men should stop cherry-picking Asian women in exchange for a mutually beneficial alliance with Asian men.
Not to be crass, but men will take pussy over abstract political ideals any day.
Anonymous said...
Of course, this doesn't take into account all the race-mixing that goes on before marriage. But something tells me that Asians aren't doing too good there either.
Yeah, considering the huge number of out-of-wedlock births, 'experimentation' by young girls and the fact that black men are almost always deadbeat dads who run a mile at the first sign of pregnancy, those stats probably don't truly reflect what's going on out there.
I have a great idea. Maybe Satoshi Kanazawa can negotiate a deal with black women where they donate their excesses testosterone to be injected into young Asian boys who might then grow taller, bigger, and hung-ier.
@Anonymous
Isn't Satoshi Kanazawa the same guy who said that black men are more attractive than non-black men?
He sounds like the Japanese Whiskey.
Well, the counterparts to the Asian American overachievers exist in the motherland as well, and have the same problems there.
My Chinese friends are perfectly happy with their status and options. In fact, one of them sent me a nice photo of himself posing with Paddy Harrington at some recent Shanghai Open. he looked perfectly suave and self-assured. He always calls me before coming to Seattle, and we go around town, stopping at various golf stores so he can stock up on the latest equipment (it's actually cheaper here).
However, the pudgy nerds have a very difficult time meeting pretty girls, who are admittedly quite ruthless about their standards in men in China. The problem is that a lot of the Asians in the US take a tack that virtually guarantees their sons will be what the Chinese refer to as "shudaizi" (bookworm/nerd), whereas that is far from the norm back home. My take on it is that the parents assume that the only way they can compete with the gwailo is through (putatively) meritocratic measures, as they are outsiders.
It's not a terrible strategy, but the kids do tend to suffer. However, here in Seattle the third and fourth generation Chinese Americans I know are pretty comfortable in their own skin, and do fine. It's the FOBs that really go too far, but I appreciate them for putting the "skeer" into the SWPL professional-class white moms who are unable to effectively compete with them.
Yeah, if you are a reasonably attractive chick, racial preferences and hostility (from other men of other races) sails over you. A reasonably attractive White or Asian woman will have all sorts of guys, White, Black, Hispanic, Asian competing for her attention, mostly, in a social setting. They might try to beat up her boyfriend (which is generally effective btw) but most of the time in social settings a reasonably attractive young White/Asian woman does not get what a White or Asian guy gets in a "diverse" setting.
Asian guys following Tiger Mother advice might as well stake out 40 year old virgin status.
"It comes down to how thoroughly beta this blog is. Many white men here are losers and need to inflate some fantasy of white male status."
I disagree.
A little.
Steve needs to balance out all the Asian IQ and academia posts. There's a pattern here. 5 Asian IQ posts followed by 1 inadequate masculinity of Asian male post. It a regular pattern. For blacks it's 5 academic failing or 5 black crime posts followed up by a black athleticism post or black musical improvisation post.
It's just all part of the Isteve wash cycle.
If Asian boys had any creativity, they would come up with the concept of 'sexual justice'. Why should big-busted blonde bimbo babes offer their pleasure only to white studs and black studs? Where is sexual justice in all this? Shouldn't all men--no matter how ugly, short, dumb, poor, etc--have access to action with super-babes? It's a right, damn it!
And good-looking men should also give sexual pleasure to fat, ugly, digusting, and gross looking women. It's an entitlement, damn it!
And if good-looking women and men say no, they are elitist-racist-uglophobes.
Sexual equality! Sexual inclusion! Sexual diversity! No more disparate impact in the bedroom. Let's have affirmative action in sex.
Proposal: Good-looking women have to have sex with 10 ugly guys a year, and same goes for good-looking men with ugly gross girls.
More like bitter rice paddy men. Genghiz Khan seemed pretty bold, risk-taking, and fun-loving.
All the Han need is an injection of cowboy genes to climb out of their static farmer rut.
Chinese men could put out feelers for mail-order brides in Mongolia, or Chinese women could shack up with the descendants of shepherds in nearby Australia or New Zealand.
For a girl to get a reasonably attractive guy, all she needs is to be reasonably attractive. Often she can pull much hotter guys than her level of attractiveness, though she'll have to share. Tiger Mother raising for daughters is probably good overall, there's a career and money to fall back on when the sex is done.
For an Asian guy, or really any guy, what gets women is Extraversion, social dominance, social power, status, and the like. POWER POWER POWER! Women are drawn to it. All the credentialism doesn't matter for girls (it's being hot or not) or guys (its being powerful or not). Women like Amy Chua fundamentally do their sons a disservice by promoting lies about credentials = women. It just means a place in the cube farm until the job can be outsourced.
Forget about Asians, apply that to Beta White guys (about 90% of White guys) and you get far greater numbers because there are many more White guys than Asian guys in the US.
Yo Whiskey, why no updates in so long, bro?
Asian boys were drilled into betadom their entire upbringing, its hard to deprogram.
They're out there getting laws passed in their favor while you're here on Steve's blog complaining about whites being progressively marginalized. How beta can they be?
The best week ever gets better: Woman (named "Lakeysha") gets kicked of an Oakland, CA to Salem, OR Amtrak train and arrested for talking too loud on her cell phone.
Oddly, Asians haven't enjoyed the benefits of the Revenge of the Nerds that you've talked about before.
Even in our nerds, we require some level of curiosity or risk-taking or enterprising, which could be as lowly as starting up a comic book / video game / horror movie convention.
Overall they seem like a brainier version of Mexicans (and so more law-abiding, etc.). No cultural dynamism. What's the picture of Asian neighborhood groups, charities, block parties, churches, etc.?
Like Mexicans, they don't seem as close-knit as blacks and Jews, but I don't have a solid impression on that.
I think the fundamental problem for asians is that their upbringing lacks "nuance"
they are taught to get grade-grub rather than "integrity."
these are values taht are implicitly taught in teh White world.
asians need to learn it.
and also that Ask a Korean (AAK) blog author was like really harsh on Wesley yang.
AAK saids taht the new show Hawaii five-O was supposed to rpove that asians have it made in the entertainment is absurd..
Hawaii 5-0 is a B-show.
Asian actors are still lacking charisma...
i think it's biological.
Mr. Yang's article is written strictly for an Asian audience. Asians remain invisible.
Agnostic, modern Mongolia is a hell-hole. It has not participated at all in the East Asian economic upswing of the last few decades. It's not emerging in any sense whatsoever. If I had to guess, I'd put its mean IQ in the 85 to 90 range. Same for ethnic Kazakhs, Kyrgiz, etc. - Mongols' nomadic cousins, who lagged behind the rest of the USSR for as long as it existed and are now sleepily lagging behind all of the former Soviet successor states.
Does a pastoralist background make a population more aggressive? Probably. But there are a million other ingredients to success. On average, mixed Han-Mongolian individuals would lag behind the rest of China economically and intellectually.
And why is southern China more economically dynamic than the north anyway? Could it be because the Mongols and the Manchus didn't have as much of an effect on it as they did on the north?
This is a blog written by a bitter white man...
Who apparently managed to enlist a bunch of bitter Asian men to make his point for him in New York Mag.
The funny paradox of life is elitism suppresses certain hierarchies and populism opens up new hierarchies.
Consider intellectual elitism. It excludes the dumb and favors the smart. But it doesn't discriminate based on height, looks, athleticism, weight, etc. One could be as short and ugly as Jean-Paul Sartre and be a big star intellectual.
Now consider cultural populism. It is anti-elitist or mass culture for the people. So, one would think it is anti-hierarchical and open to everyone to participate and succeed in. After all, if most people are low-brow and if mass tastes are about low appetites, it would be inclusive of most people, right? Wrong. What are the primary appetites of the masses? Take professional wrestling and the NFL. Both are mass culture sports, but how many men can be pro wrestlers with huge muscles? How many men can make it into the NFL which only recruits the fastest, toughest, and strongest?
And consider sexual and culinary appetites. Since mass tastes are not refined, subtle, or nuanced, they favor the biggest boobs, the biggest penises, biggest asses, biggest burgers, sugariest pies and candies, loudest music, glitziest personalties, and etc.
Eventually, junk food restaurants come to dominate food culture and sexual expression--through music, movies, and porn--all turn into a case of 'I got the biggest boobs' and 'I got the biggest pud'. So, instead of ridding society of hierarchies, populism creates new hierarchies based on the crudest animal appetites. In its mass appeal, it is indeed popular with the masses. But mass culture is not about the people themselves but the EXTREME fantasies of the people who want the biggest, baddest, etc, etc.
And look at our blockbusters. It's EXTREME cinema. It has mass appeal, but it's so expensive, over-the-top, grandiose pop-fascist, and loud that only superrich and superskilled Hollywood execs and professionals can create them. Everyone else just mindlessly consumes them. And those movies have NOTHING to do with us, the real people.
It goes real people don't wanna be real. They wanna escape into the fantasy of extremism: power, looks, sexuality, charisma, etc.
This could be why Pasolini said consumerism is making little fascists out of everyone. By feeding on people's fantasies of animal pleasure, godlike power, and fame/glamour, it removes us away from our real livea and makes us wanna be Michael Vick or Britney Spears.
I guess same goes for money. Libertarian-conservatives argued that greater economic freedom for all would make all of us richer. But in fact, equal freedom for all means the smartest, most industrious, most cutthroat, and/or the best connected rise way above the rest. So, in the past 30 yrs, greater economic freedom hasn't made everyone rich. It made some grow richer and superricher while others ended up worse than before. Getting rid of state-enforced hierarchy opened up new hiearchies which turned out to be even more extreme.
"It's just all part of the Isteve wash cycle."
Well, Asians are good at laundry(unless their customer is some crazy black guy with a funny pair of pants).
an asian immigrant once spoke of "doing" sex with a big titty blonde girl, i corrected him and told him it was about "having" sex.
but the more i thought about it, he was right.
sex is a doing more than a having.
thank you Mr. Kwon of west 188th street in the bronx.
there is a site called goldsea.com where east asians can go to do some explicit, unedited complaining. i haven't been there in a long time but there was a lot of anger posted 10 years ago when i was reading it once in a while. southeast asians show up there too i'm sure. but i don't think it's for south asians. it's called gold sea, after all.
One reason Yang doesn't get my sympathy is he complains of being excluded but his kind did their utmost to rise to a station from where they could exclude others. He wants to hang around and be accepted by the 'best people'.
It's not like he wanted to be part of the ordinary people and found himself excluded by them. He got excluded from an exclusive world he wanted to join.
So, his complaint comes down to "I busted my butt to join the exclusive club, but it won't have me."
This is all narcissistic BS. He should worry less about himself about other people. If he tries to be a good person and help others and do a good job, things will happen. Not everything he wants but enough to make his life meaningful. It's like the Stones song, You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes you just might find just what you need.
He should go among poor Mexicans and try to teach them something or work as a doctor. He will be appreciated. And he might even find a nice senorita. If he thinks he's too good for poor Mexicans, then why shouldn't other groups feel they are too good for him?
To be sure, his complaint is useful to us in the sense it exposes the BS promise of equality and 'inclusion' in the white liberal community. In fact, it is a very exclusive world. The hell with swapples. We on the white right know that very well.
One problem with 'Is Love Colorblind?'
It should really be 'Is Lust Colorblind?'
If he doesn't like it here he knows where the exits are. The accurate definition of "White racism" is simply denying non-whites the right to live off of us. That's the only thing that brought these whining colonialists here.
American born asian men actually marry out at a fairly high rate, like 40+ % or something. In fact, they marry out at a higher rate than Blacks.
Blacks are 10% of the population, but black men gets only 1~2% of the white women population. East Asians are only 2%, but they also get 1% of the white women.
Statistically, a white woman is actually more likely to marry Asian than Black. Don't know how you guys missed that one.
In conclusion: whine more please. Asians got nothing to whine about.
"Asian boys were drilled into betadom their entire upbringing, its hard to deprogram."
They're out there getting laws passed in their favor
No, they aren't.
while you're here on Steve's blog complaining about whites being progressively marginalized. How beta can they be?
What could be more beta than trolling Steve's blog by psychologically projecting your own betaness on to others?
K Town...Jersey Shore for Asians
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbW-XYqbol0&feature=player_embedded
How one can embrace the reality of "HBD" and the alchemy of "Game" at once is beyond me. "Beat more people up" is beyond parody; yes, just the ticket for the insecure, 140-lb post-adolescent.
But I'll wager one thing: this adopt-the-Alpha's ways-become-the-Alpha strategy will not survive a punch in the face.
The big city bar scene is no place for nerds. A better strategy? Move to a small town. Join a church.
Women like Amy Chua fundamentally do their sons a disservice by promoting lies about credentials = women. It just means a place in the cube farm until the job can be outsourced.
Whiskey, it depends on what the credentials are. An electrical engineer might have a more difficult time in obtaining a wife. But an MD won't. I know a few MDs and they all have high end wives even though none of them are what you would call 'alpha'. Women flock to anyone with 'MD' after their name.
So, is this an argument for ethnic groups staying apart? Wouldn't these hard-working intelligent Asian men be better off in an all Asian society? As it is in America, many of their women get poached off by Whites and others - and that is almost impossible to stop.
"My initial impression is that white men should stop cherry-picking Asian women in exchange for a mutually beneficial alliance with Asian men."
This is a point.
Since white women have less and less value in the dating market, and in the marriage market. Many are brainwashed by feminists and liberals, and this is a trend.
A frequent suggestion for nice guys is to go after Asian girls (and maybe expat totally from Western countries), because they are more intelligent and feminine.
True or not, it seems the problem of Asian men is never faced. What do they think of white men getting "their" women? (pass me the quotes instead of a complex psychological evaluation)
Probably at present it is not so diffused phenomenon, but I do not think white women will change soon. I just hope there will be Asian girls for everyone...
And yes, as a white I could not care less if black thugs get all the white Western women, they are not meant to marry anyway.
Actually I am pretty sure all this creates hostility towards Whites on the part of Asian men - so any White guys gloating is probably not too smart.
I remember remarking to an Asian coworker about how I thought affirmative action in my work group was helping the women out more than they deserved. He was immediately unsympathetic and let me know it. He basically mocked my concern, said I was a crybaby, and then proceeded to tell me how he was the real victim in his own group (mostly of white males keeping him down).
Mind you he was a pretty good friend, but his reaction to my complaint was immediate and fierce - he had no time to listen to a white male raise concerns. I don't think this bodes well.
@Anonymous
Women flock to anyone with 'MD' after their name.
Yes, in their late 20s/30s, when they want to 'settle' and win a 'provider' after going through a succession of broke alpha douchebags during their prime years.
MD = $$$. Girls aren't interested in MDs until the schooling/residency is over and the money is pouring in, which is around age 30. At that point, most physicians are married or in a serious relationship.
Wealthy and decent looking Asian/Indian guys with high powered jobs do okay with white girls, but only for LT relationships or marriage. Not flings or anything casual. Even when they do get a girl, they're generally limited to, at best, average looking women.
Asian/Indian women/moms love MDs. White and NAM women, not so much.
Mongolia is a hellhole because a race of nomads are being forced to sedentarize. You might as well send Ashkenazi Jews to hack it in the rainforest.
Re: Mongolian IQ, last paper I saw was this:
http://www.mankindquarterly.org/spring2007_lynn.html
Overall IQ is 5 pts lower than the Han, verbal IQ is 10 pts lower, but visual-spatial is 2 pts *higher*. Admittedly verbal matters more for entrepreneurial work, but the point remains that Mongols are not dumb compared to the Chinese -- after all, Europeans are about 5 pts lower than the Han in overal IQ.
But yes, the main reason for them to interbreed would be to get personality traits more than intelligence.
Yes, in their late 20s/30s, when they want to 'settle' and win a 'provider' after going through a succession of broke alpha douchebags during their prime years.
Yes. This is why American men need to bring back the "double standard" and start referring to sluts as ... sluts. These women shouldn't be allowed to have their cake and eat it too; to be sluts and yet reap the benefits of being a decent woman later.
I wonder what guys are thinking sometime. Are you really OK with half the guys you see knowing they tapped your wife back in the day?
Then I would at least expect Mongolia to produce high-quality engineers and technicians.
The author has the key in his article as to why so many Asians hit the "bamboo ceiling" in the workplace (and it's not the white devil):
Like the music teacher said, “They were mediocre kids, but they got in because they were coached.”
Steve, you never posted the recent LA times article profiling two families in a good school district. The Asian family sending their kid to 6 (!) hours of tutoring a day and the Jewish/Mexican one making sure their child goes to museums in the summer instead of cram school. If it takes you 6 hours daily of tutoring to pass your APs and get into UCLA, are you really that smart? What happens in the workplace when you have to think outside the textbook and find creative solutions? Which doctor would you rather go to? The brilliant kid who could score 1600 on the SAT without even trying or the kid who had to go to years of cram school? For all their test scores, they are not that smart.
He recommends, reasonably, that Asian guys study Game and other self-help techniques.
Anyone who finds that suggestion 'reasonable' has not met enough such "Asian guys".
And BTW, most Asian women who marry white men do not marry white men who have any idea of "Game".
You're a big man, but Steve Hsu could take you down. (If he were bitter, which he ain't).
there's like 2 million people in mongolia. they aren't producing anything.
i rather doubt mongolia is a hellhole. more like a vast, expansive, empty wasteland.
i don't know whether the locals should curse their luck for having no oil fields, or thank their luck for having no oil fields. sparsely populated nation in central asia with huge oil fields and only 2 million people to defend them from invasion? yeah, they'd be getting invaded.
You're a big man, but Steve Hsu could take you down.
No.
"there's like 2 million people in mongolia. they aren't producing anything."
There's a huge mining boom going on in Mongolia right now.
Poor Steve still going back to his almost 15 year old Colorblind article based on marriage data of White male/Asian female marriages that include military/war brides or mail-order brides. Why he continues to omit these facts is unknown to me?
On the other hand, Steve ignores than '42% of US-born Asian men are married to non-Asian women'. Or that Asian men in the US have the EXACT same marriage patterns as Hispanic men (low intermarriage for immigrants, high intermarriage for those born in the US).
In addition, the author of the NY Mag article (Wesley Yang) states himself that he never dated an Asian women and the first subject of the NY Mag article (former Chinese Stuyvesant student who wants to be writer) talks about going over to his white girlfriend's house during the holidays.
Dennis Dale: "How one can embrace the reality of 'HBD' and the alchemy of 'Game' at once is beyond me."
i never get that, either. every guy can't be an alpha male 'cause every guy is not an alpha male.
"You're a big man, but Steve Hsu could take you down.
=========
No."
Hsu vs Sailer? Hsu easy. He knows martial arts. And I'm pretty sure even Amy Chua could dust Sailer.
i saw the cover funny how even successful minorities are adapting the 'poor us' victimology. Hindus/Indians are as well (visit the sepoy mutiny blog).
Of course, bitter oriental national cover stories never mention:
a. the epidemic of black on oriental crime - they need to play by the globalist script if they want airtime.
b. the possible suggestion that they might be happier back in asia or or with other orientals. ... so perhaps segregation ain't such a bad idea? Orientals can compete within their turf, us, in ours.
I live in brooklyn, under 30 i see far more orietnal male + white woman pairs than the reverse. My theory? The askanazi elite have basically eliminated white HETERO males from graduate schools/elite colleges (and the ones that do make it are in manahattan with hot whites, or as a second choice, oriental women) there is basically no other choice in their in groups.
"Asian male solidarity for the simple reason that Asian males don't even like each other."
Don't know if you're really an Asian female or an Asian assassin, but this is so, so abject in the old style, old school.
I won't make a decent reply, just note that you made this statement though.
"Yes. This is why American men need "to bring back the "double standard" and start referring to sluts as ... sluts. These women shouldn't be allowed to have their cake and eat it too; to be sluts and yet reap the benefits of being a decent woman later."
What are they? Who died and made you King Slut-o-phobe? Could you provide an inventory of costs and debits? Also a definition of "slut", "decent woman", and definitely, a definition of a "decent man."
Lou Grant told Mary Tyler Moore the limit was 6 men per lifetime. Something definite, something we can get a grip on, and aspire towards.
As an acculturated Asian whose had some success with both white women and Asian women, I'll say that pretty much anything works with women. The point is in the trying.
Anger works, money works, shyness works, humor works, most of all persistence works. It may not work with your 1st choice or 2nd choice, but it will work eventually. 5th choice or 19th choice. You just have to be realistic.
It also helps not to be surrounded by white cock-block and underminers. Obviously you're dead if this is your situation. Some Asian men are dead in the water because this is all they've know their entire lives. Especially the ones who were adopted by socially unaware, dim-bulb white parents. Very sad. So you get one source of complainers.
Asian men will get their just desserts, just takes some time. There's no way Boston College beats Harvard in the long run. No way.
There are certain artists who, when they say "people", mean "men". Heinlein and Sorkin come to mind.
Anyway, this article doesn't purport to describe East Asian men, but rather Asian Americans. Which is really part of the problem--that when we went from Oriental, Indian, Filipino, and Pacific Islander to one size fits all Asian, we lost a lot of useful information.
Assuming the real title is or should be "Angry Chinese Guys Who Can't Get Laid", it's still way off. The author himself didn't grow up in a cocoon and clearly wasn't ever an overachiever. Neither are the other two examples (one is a poet, for god's sake). The most likely reason these guys didn't get laid is because they were not typically "Asian" and ignored their parents.
Way too focused on one subgroup of a subgroup of a subgroup (smart underachieving "losers" who happen to have had demanding Asian parents) for a piece that purports to describe all of Asian Americans. Even assuming the narrower target, it's still off base.
Are they more likely to become haters of White people and traditional America because of these feelings? I can see that.
Become?
However, the pudgy nerds have a very difficult time meeting pretty girls, who are admittedly quite ruthless about their standards in men in China.
And thats ramped up up by the increasing surplus of men over women (one child policy).
It's just all part of the Isteve wash cycle.
Lol!
"Whiskey, it depends on what the credentials are. An electrical engineer might have a more difficult time in obtaining a wife. But an MD won't. I know a few MDs and they all have high end wives even though none of them are what you would call 'alpha'. Women flock to anyone with 'MD' after their name."
Yes, you need to get credentials that translate into money. Money can make up for beta-ness when it comes to attracting women. You don't need to be an alpha to be among the top 2% of earners if you're smart enough and in the right field.
"there's like 2 million people in mongolia. they aren't producing anything."
http://www.aei.org/outlook/28731
"Mongolia. Possessed of abundant natural resources, including Asia's largest copper mine and enormous uranium deposits, Mongolia is also a stable, if emerging, democracy, lauded by President Bush on his 2005 visit. Charges of illicit deals benefiting the governing--formerly Communist--party and fears of ballot fraud that led to riots in the capital city of Ulan Bator after parliamentary elections earlier this spring provide some indications of the obstacles facing this infant democracy. Mongolia sits uneasily between Russia and China and is actively searching for help from the United States to maintain its economic and strategic independence. Over the past year, Russia has moved aggressively to make Mongolia an economic satellite. Raising oil prices through blackmail and seeking exclusive concessions have allowed Russia to carve out a significant role in Mongolia's economy.[7] But predominance goes to China, whose economic influence over Ulan Bator continues to grow as it has sought to build up its Central Asian presence.
Washington can naturally play the role of third neighbor to Mongolia, expanding trade and security relations (Mongolia has already dispatched forces to Iraq) in a bid to deny strategic control to either Moscow or Beijing. Equally important, in light of the riots after this year's parliamentary elections, America should commit public diplomacy resources, as well as economic and security incentives, to persuade Mongolians not to retreat from the liberal path they have been following for two decades. Promoting a free trade agreement between the United States and Mongolia would provide alternative markets and sources of investment for the Mongolians and would send a strong message about Washington's interests in the heart of Eurasia."
Statistics for marriages in 2008: 41.7% of US-born Asian American men marry outside compared to 50.8% of US-born Asian American women marrying outside.
Those are percentages of "newlyweds." There's no accounting for men (and women) who do not marry at all. They are the bitter ones.
"Claudia Zhao said...
there will never be Asian male solidarity for the simple reason that Asian males don't even like each other."
There are billions of Asian men. The unhappy man who wrote this article is in a particular kind of environment. I don't think he has a complaint, because I dare say a white person born in Korea or China would have a much harder time gaining acceptance in those cultures. Asians in Asia and Asians in heavily Asian places like Washington state, can view themselves as individuals. Individuals may dislike other individuals.
I hate to sound preachy but sometimes commenters here are so damn childish...often I don't read the original article just the comments. This time I read every word of the orignial article and I am startled and amused at what commenters notice--how boiled down to adolescent concerns. For me, the drunk woman telling him that if you're not a winner, you have to love the world twice as hard is the wisest and hardest advice to take and the take-away tagline. Yet I don't think anybody discussess that.
Given the atrocious historic levels of internecine warfare, strife and contention among Europeans, we are in no position to cast aspersions on perceived self-loathing in non-Europeans.
I think Asian guys are having the same trouble in their home countries.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hMO3yVin2U
Once Asian girls got to seeing anime with big blonde guys and American TV, Asian guys aren't enough.
Btw, didn't Spielberg's AI begin with a joke about some Asian geek using androids for sexual pleasure? Rotfl.
I'm always puzzled that Asian guys haven't done anything about this state of affair except to complain of course. If this were any other race, the guys would be doing something. Something drastic to make a statement.
Asian men are like black women-they get the leftovers...
My take on Asian males is a little different. They seem jolly to me.
Try to remember Seven Samurai and the remake The Magnificent Seven. In one of them the warriors are always taciturn and bitter. In the other they are laughing all the time. They're merry.
I certainly didn't remember it that way, but watch them both for yourself. The American cowboys are dour. They are prone to philosophical musings about their unhappy fate. The Japanese samurais are jolly. They go out to the chop-chop with a smile on their face.
Albertosaurus
It took millions of man hours from the 1880s onwards to create a society as fractious, balkanized, animalistic, divided and conflicted as the modern US. I'm sure the people responsible are very proud.
"Try to remember Seven Samurai and the remake The Magnificent Seven. In one of them the warriors are always taciturn and bitter. In the other they are laughing all the time. They're merry."
But try to remember HARA KIRI and SAMURAI REBELLION. Not too many haw haw samurai there.
"theres like 2 million people in Mongolia right now. they arent producing anything." BullSHIT! Have you caught any of the musical theatre coming out of there these days? Amazing!
Also a definition of "slut", "decent woman", and definitely, a definition of a "decent man."
A slut is a woman who wigs out when you call her a slut.
"sparsely populated nation in central asia with huge oil fields and only 2 million people to defend them from invasion?"
Which is why Mongolian are grateful as hell to Russia. Russia defended their independence in the past and still guarantees it.
As it is in America, many of their women get poached off by Whites and others
Most of the poaching of Asian women is by White males, due to the fact that the Elite has increasingly monopolized White females and that White females have been pursuing careers, delaying marriage.
White women have been herded into being corporate concubines for the top private rent-seekers in the corporate boardrooms, and public bureaucracy concubines for the top public rent-seekers, and their instinct has been to try to land one of these top rent-seekers.
Asian females have acted as a kind of "safety valve" for White males who have been excluded as a result of increasing monopolization of White females. Without a "safety valve" the prospects for conflict and tension would be higher than it already is and could have jeopardized the monopolization of White females prematurely. It at least buys time during which prime females can be monopolized.
It's basically a Ponzi scheme, and like all Ponzi schemes it eventually approaches its limit as new "players" run out - in this case another group to replace the Asian females for the Asian males.
"In Mongolia, Vale SA (VALE5), the world’s largest iron ore supplier, and Xstrata Plc (XTA), the No. 1 thermal coal exporter, are leading six groups bidding for a 1 billion metric ton concession at the Tavan Tolgoi coal project.
Rio Tinto, the world’s No. 2 mining company, is developing the Oyu Tolgoi copper and gold deposit, which it expects will account for 30 percent of Mongolia’s gross domestic product when completed."
pretty sure vale, rio tinto, and xstrata are not mongolian mining companies. i don't see how mongolia is much different than south africa, or iraq for that matter. they required foreign brainpower to develop their minerals.
i think i told you guys about my friend at MIT who is a materials science researcher and was the guy who went to bill gates for VC money. anyway he knows marius kloppers, who i guess was also the same major at MIT, though years earlier.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marius_Kloppers
one of the reasons i objected to steve's portrayal of europeans in south africa as mostly lucky and lazy. they do an incredible, nearly superhuman job of keeping that place running. they even pulled off a world cup.
steve hsu has an athletic build, especially for an Asian, and he has trained in BJJ and mma. He could probably beat up most guys.
Those mixed-Asian kids? Why would they? You are just an old, despised White guy who's been oppressing the noble, Asian, half of their ancestry. Ask Obama who's side a mixed kid will be on
You don't know many mixed-Asian kids do you? Of all the mixed Asians I've met mainland (sample abt 30 throughout the US), I've only met one who dated someone other than a white man/woman (one hapa guy I knew dated an asian woman).
Mixed white/asian kids identify as white more often than black/white kids identify as black. Most the mixed white/asian kids are high-IQ and leftish in bent - perhaps that's what you were going for?
I know. I know. Most couples in any sort of long term relationship are within a few points of each other in IQ. Asians and whites approximate in IQ. The average is a little higher among most north Asians, but the right and left bell curve fringes are more populated among whites.
Among married couples, the average is within 5 points. There is never, and I repeat, NEVER, going to be widespread intermarriage among blacks and whites such as there is among Asians and whites, no matter how much "integration" occurs. It isn't just IQ--it's style and culture, which never seem to change.
Thus, Affirmative Action must artificially raise the "effective IQs" of NAMs while depressing the effective IQs of Asains/Indians.
While the real IQ cannot be changed, AA policies, laws and practices in academia, government and business can enforce admissions, hiring, advancement, contracts and other preferences that are are otherwise the natural result of IQ and correlated diligence.
Since IQ disparaties are greater at the tail ends, the AA NAM preferences and Asian anti-preferences have to be stronger there. It seems like the SAT penalty reported by Eppenshade against Asians at Princeton was higher than a 1SD hit confirming this.
"You don't know many mixed-Asian kids do you? Of all the mixed Asians I've met mainland (sample abt 30 throughout the US), I've only met one who dated someone other than a white man/woman (one hapa guy I knew dated an asian woman)."
I'm curious where you're located.
Here in San Jose, I also know about 30 some half-asian hapas, and the majority of them date Asian simply due to the proximity and the large ratio of Asians nearby.
The same goes for the hapas that live in Asia(I know... duh). If anything, a number of Asian male celebs tend to have a trophy half-Asian girlfriend these days.
So in essence, it is almost like the white is eventually being bred out once you reach areas of Asian population tipping point. This may be even more prevalent in the future as white population continues to fall while more and more Asians start moving into the west and snatching up real estate.
Sad really. Even in situations where whites are supposedly marginalizing others... they end up being marginalizing themselves even more. LOL.
"Also a definition of "slut", "decent woman", and definitely, a definition of a "decent man."
Well everyone knows that a "slut" is a woman who fucks everyone including you and a "bitch" is a woman who fucks everyone except you.
@TomV
"Those are percentages of "newlyweds." There's no accounting for men (and women) who do not marry at all. They are the bitter ones."
So that would simply prove it is a fringe group of a fringe, correct?
Last time I checked, Asians do have the highest marriage rates in the US. Anecdote wise, every Asian male I knew back in college are pretty much all married by now.
"Which is why Mongolian are grateful as hell to Russia. Russia defended their independence in the past and still guarantees it."
But Soviet-backed commies in Mongolia did a lot of killing.
"steve hsu has an athletic build"
Who in the hell is Steve Hsu?
Does anyone have the statistic on how many/what percentage of eligible Asian men in the US are single or never married by 40?
Compare that to the figure for Asian females.
Compare male/female US Asian marriage rate imbalance with other groups, esp male/female US Blacks.
Does anyone know the history of what happened to all those single Chiense men imported into hard labor on Carribean or HI Plantations or Western rail roads? What percent married, died single and went back?
What is/will happen in Africa as Chinese men economically colonize it? Will they intermarry with the locals or opt to be childless?
"And yes, as a white I could not care less if black thugs get all the white Western women, they are not meant to marry anyway."
I'll be sure to tell your mother you said that.
...pretty much anything works with women. The point is in the trying.
...It may not work with your 1st choice or 2nd choice, but it will work eventually. 5th choice or 19th choice. You just have to be realistic.
I see you are a graduate of the Jeff Boomhauer School of Picking Up Women.
If anything, a number of Asian male celebs tend to have a trophy half-Asian girlfriend these days.
This isn't true at all. The opposite is the case.
"I think Asian men should take Whiskey's advice and 'thug it up.' Just like this guy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cmr1c1mT8RY "
Uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuugggggggggg!!!!! Eww.
Who in the hell is Steve Hsu?
University of Oregon professor of physics.
"This isn't true at all. The opposite is the case.
5/18/11 1:57 PM"
False.
False.
True.
From "Macho Minority: Masculinity and Ethnicity on the Edge of Tibet" by Hillman and Henfry, 2006:
Like the nomadic Mongols, the Tibetan people are frequently represented by a robust masculine image. (...)
The women viewed the Tibetans as bigger, taller, stronger, darker-skinned, rougher, more masculine, and more loyal than other men. Other expressions they applied to Tibetan men included “open-minded,” “generous,” “unpretentious,” and “decisive.” (...) Of the 18 female Han respondents, 16 thought that Tibetan men were more masculine than all other men, including other ethnic groups in China and foreign nationals.
(...) unexpectedly, instead of describing the masculine in reference to the feminine, Tibetan men repeatedly contrasted their masculinity with that of Han Chinese men. (...) All the Tibetan women we interviewed considered Tibetan men to be more masculine than men from other ethnic backgrounds.
Send more Asian women, please. Yum yum.
Asian men can stay at home, thank you.
I didn't get the impression that Yang was bitter. He seems more a person who's a little annoyed by stereotypes, and wants Asians to pursue a wider range of interests. Ragarding dating, second generation Asian men have an easier time baggin' white chicks if they grew up around whites, speak without an accent and have "white tastes". Same applies to black men.
I suppose it also depends on the setting. Upper middle class, city dwelling yuppie white women claim to love "nerds" so much but they don't generally go for Asian guys. These types prefer white yuppie men, or foreign white guys with model-like appearances.
The more typical suburban bred white woman also prefers white guys, but is probably open to dating an Asian.
"For f**k's sake, Steve-o, just google Fulani woman on google images - some of these women are stunning (yes, I am into the exotic)."
I agree.
"I also notice black male/white female relationships tend to be viewed as the products of coercion. Black men are always described as aggressive harassers of white women rather than charmers."
I agree.
"There is never, and I repeat, NEVER, going to be widespread intermarriage among blacks and whites such as there is among Asians and whites, no matter how much "integration" occurs. It isn't just IQ--it's style and culture, which never seem to change."
If you're talking strictly in terms of the U.S., I would agree. On a global scale, no. Widespread intermarriage between blacks and whites has taken place in various societies for thousands of years.
"What is/will happen in Africa as Chinese men economically colonize it? Will they intermarry with the locals or opt to be childless?"
I imagine the former to be the case. They'll produce a new race that, presumably, will be gifted in math and basketball. And like Tiger, will be well versed in spitting game to white women. Be afraid, boy. Be very afraid.
"I imagine the former to be the case. They'll produce a new race that, presumably, will be gifted in math and basketball. And like Tiger, will be well versed in spitting game to white women. Be afraid, boy. Be very afraid."
Sorry, I can't remember the details of the project, but I read that when the Chinese left a central African country after working for years on the project, they were proud of never having left a single half-Chinese child in Africa.
The things people are proud of tell more about their culture than anything.
I'm curious where you're located.
Here in San Jose, I also know about 30 some half-asian hapas, and the majority of them date Asian simply due to the proximity and the large ratio of Asians nearby.
I've lived in the Midwest, California (Bay Area, LA and Orange Co), Texas and studied/traveled East many times (Boston, DC, NYC).
Our different experiences may be generational. Several decades ago there were not so many Asians and most were into assimilation. Today that is not the case.
The hapas I know, including many in my extended family (both coasts and HI), are all married to whites and fully assimilated. Only two even dated Asians before marriage.
Too bad for this Asian guy who took Wesley Yang's advice.
In today's Daily Californian:
"Student regent resigns after sex crime allegations
By Katie Nelson
Daily Cal Senior Staff Writer
Thursday, May 19, 2011
Jesse Cheng officially announced his resignation from his position as the UC Student Regent on Monday, ending his term that had been marred by controversy.
Cheng's term took a contentious turn when he was arrested by Irvine police in November on suspicion of sexual battery. Accused of inappropriately touching a woman who only identified herself as "Laya" in order to protect her identity as a victim of an alleged sex crime, Cheng was later found responsible of a student conduct violation for sexual battery by the UC Irvine Student Conduct Office in March."
"What is/will happen in Africa as Chinese men economically colonize it? Will they intermarry with the locals or opt to be childless?"
I imagine the former to be the case. They'll produce a new race that, presumably, will be gifted in math and basketball. And like Tiger, will be well versed in spitting game to white women. Be afraid, boy. Be very afraid."
Chinese don't have enough of an IQ advantage. Chinese/African intermarriage will result in blacks with approximately the same intelligence as typical light skinned blacks in the US.
And like Tiger, will be well versed in spitting game to white women.
Ha. The only "game" Tiger had was the Fame & Wealth Game. Become a billionaire celebrity jock and you, too, can have crazy, second-rate skanks as mistresses and a rampaging man-jawed Valkyrie for your wife.
If you're talking strictly in terms of the U.S., I would agree. On a global scale, no. Widespread intermarriage between blacks and whites has taken place in various societies for thousands of years.
No. You had a handful of Spaniards and Portugese in South America, without European women. You had Arabs in Africa and the Middle East, for whom "marriage" meant concubinage. Certainly they have absorbed more negroid genes in the past 1,000 years according to genetic studies, and it doesn't seem to have done them much good. Even for them, things have changed. As far as Europe, the number of blacks who marry whites is still small and selective, as in a place like upper New England or the mid-West U.S. So no, there haven't been many "marriages" as we know them among blacks and whites. The relationships were intrinsically unequal wheverever there was slavery, even if the woman was free.
Two people who choose to live together for years on end, are going to have to be near in IQ. Given all the differences besides IQ, it isn't going to happen much. Indeed, one web site promoting interracial mixing--because they are "mulattos"--even noted a decrease in interracial marriages which the media distorts. I don't kow about that, but I think in most places where blacks and whites are both in large percentages and in close proximity (I'm thinking D.C., NY, Chicago) it's maxed out. Whites are not allowed to express displeasure about it, so nowadays, if blacks and whites don't get together for meaningful relationshps it cannot be blamed on the cruel world. It's because they don't want to be together. As Steve has pointed out, Hispanics married whites much more before the 90s, when the numbers became huger and more started to marry other Hispanics.
Anyone who finds that suggestion 'reasonable' has not met enough such "Asian guys". (re: Asian guys should learn Game)
Can you elaborate on what you mean by this, eh?
"Send more Asian women, please. Yum yum.
Asian men can stay at home, thank you."
But Asian men run most of the Chinese restaurants. Yum yum.
"Sorry, I can't remember the details of the project..."
Funny how no one here can remember details when the situation calls for them. In any case, I was being facetious (or performing sceintific analysis, depending on who you ask.)
"No. You had a handful of Spaniards and Portugese in South America, without European women. You had Arabs in Africa and the Middle East, for whom "marriage" meant concubinage. Certainly they have absorbed more negroid genes in the past 1,000 years according to genetic studies, and it doesn't seem to have done them much good."
The first sentence is true and a well known fact. The statements that follow are a muddled assortment of your personal views, which you failed to substantiate. The term "Arabs", in the truest sense, applies to the native occupants of lower southwest Asia(namely modern day Oman, Saudia Arabia and Yemen) whom had intermixed with Africans for thousands of years prior to the founding of Islam, in the paleolithic, when marriage of any kind may or may not have been a human cultural norm.
Much later (after Islam was founded) this group intermarried with every people that they colonized, including East and North Africans, as well as Palestenians. Whether or not it did them much good is irrelevant. What matters is that it's factual.
"Even for them, things have changed. As far as Europe, the number of blacks who marry whites is still small and selective, as in a place like upper New England or the mid-West U.S. So no, there haven't been many "marriages" as we know them among blacks and whites. The relationships were intrinsically unequal wheverever there was slavery, even if the woman was free."
The number of blacks in Europe who marry whites is much higher than in New England and the Midwest U.S. In old England, for example, blacks intermarry with whites at a rate of nearly 50%. And prior to the 1960s, virtually all relationships among common men and women were intrinsically unequal.
"Two people who choose to live together for years on end, are going to have to be near in IQ."
This is probably true. But even so, there are more than a few whites with IQ scores on par with blacks.
"Given all the differences besides IQ, it isn't going to happen much."
It already has happened. For example, during the Moorish occupation of the Iberian Peninsula. That's why most white "Meds" have detectable African ancestry. I assume you think of the Moors as fellow "caucasians". But even granting you this, it's quite clear that they were mixed with, if not members of, the sub-saharan African race. It's also well known that the Greeks intermarried with Nubians and Ethiopians in times of yore. Presently Greeks, on avarage, carry about 5% African DNA while Sicilians carry about 10%.
"Steve has pointed out, Hispanics married whites much more before the 90s, when the numbers became huger and more started to marry other Hispanics."
This can be said for any groups of people in any society. The more populous a group becomes, the fewer they marry out. In terms of a global scale, this means that a more populous group (Asians) will marry out less than a less populous group (Blacks). Like it or not, that's how it is. If you want sources, holla.
But Asian men run most of the Chinese restaurants. Yum yum.
Lol, okay, good point, but they gotta stay in the kitchen while their women come with us.
"It already has happened. For example, during the Moorish occupation of the Iberian Peninsula. That's why most white "Meds" have detectable African ancestry."
That canard again. Have you ever been to Spain? Italy? The aquiline faces with their often smallish mouths and hooded eyes looking like profiles from Roman coins, are the antithesis of sub-Saharan Africans. and all due respect, but I have not seen a single Mafia don who looks anywhere near Negroid. At most, somewhat middle-eastern. The closest might be Al Capone, who according to his great-niece, had clear blue eyes.
Dienekes the Greek(http://dienekes.blogspot.com/) and others, including Racial Reality, have answered this ver well for years now. DNA has been done and does not show significant ancestry of black Africans. The "Moors" there were mostly Arabs and Persians, and not that many of them. White Spaniard did not mix with African Negros to any great extent.
Blacks apparently want so much to be part of the white race's record of achievement and of course their appearance. \
Stop with the fantasies. Spaniards do not look like Negroes. The face and body type of some of them resembles Arabs. Negroid--very rarely.
"Presently Greeks, on avarage, carry about 5% African DNA while Sicilians carry about 10%."
Marlo, your estimate comes from a not universally shared interpretation of uniparental markers. Moreover, the more recent autosomal DNA studies that survey many hundreds of thousands of markers across the whole genome consistently indicate low single digit percentages of Sub-Saharan admixture, at most.
Wow. another thread that ends with people upset at the idea of "brothas" tapping white chicks.
'Wow. another thread that ends with people upset at the idea of "brothas" tapping white chicks."
uh, no. we are discussing the genetic makeup of southern europeans. go take a cold shower.
I like taking jobs away from white american guys.
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