SCHOOLS CRITICIZED FOR BANS ON DREADLOCKS, AFROS
BY LEANNE ITALIE
"Why are you so sad?" a TV reporter asked the little girl with a bright pink bow in her hair.
"Because they didn't like my dreads," she sobbed, wiping her tears. "I think that they should let me have my dreads."
With those words, second-grader Tiana Parker of Tulsa, Okla., found herself, at age 7, at the center of decades of debate over standards of black beauty, cultural pride and freedom of expression.
It was no isolated incident at the predominantly black Deborah Brown Community School, which in the face of outrage in late August apologized and rescinded language banning dreadlocks, Afros, mohawks and other "faddish" hairstyles it had called unacceptable and potential health hazards.
A few weeks earlier, another charter school, the Horizon Science Academy in Lorain, Ohio, sent a draft policy home to parents that proposed a ban on "Afro-puffs and small twisted braids." It, too, quickly apologized and withdrew the wording.
But at historically black Hampton University in Hampton, Va., the dean of the business school has defended and left in place a 12-year-old prohibition on dreadlocks and cornrows for male students in a leadership seminar for MBA candidates, saying the look is not businesslike.
As for black hair styles, I'd point out the male v. female division. Most cultures in the world, other than, say, Masai and Rastafarian, endorse longer hair on women than on men. I read back in the 1990s that white women's hair will grow, on average, 12 inches longer than white men's hair before falling out, which makes long hair a sex-linked trait. (I haven't seen that since, so don't take it on faith. Anybody know for sure?) Among blacks, however, hair grows so short overall that the sex difference (if it exists) is small in an absolute sense.
So, black women have substantial problems with their hair competing in integrated countries with longer haired women for men. This leads to African-American women spending a huge amount of money and time on their hair (see Chris Rock's documentary Good Hair, and above is the "Good & Bad Hair" musical number from School Daze.)
So, I sympathize with black women who try to come up with a look for their hair that doesn't involve scary chemicals (and especially for those who try to keep weird hair-straightening potions away from their little girls' scalps).
So, I sympathize with black women who try to come up with a look for their hair that doesn't involve scary chemicals (and especially for those who try to keep weird hair-straightening potions away from their little girls' scalps).
In contrast, black men may have fewer hair issues than white men. Michael Jordan started going bald so he shaved his head. Perhaps he would have been even more popular with a full head of hair, but, if I recall correctly, he was fairly popular as is. So, it seems perfectly reasonable for Hampton's B-School to enforce professional-looking hair norms for their male students. I mean if Harvard Business School polices how its students dress on Halloween in the name of feminism, why can't Hampton Business School police how its male students wear their hair in the name of getting a job?
A met a hippie at a Rainbow Gathering who said the reason the Old Testament spoke (somewhere I do not remember) of women having long hair was not because men should cut their hair short but because women naturally grew it longer.
ReplyDeleteLtet's jusy rell it like it is---cornrows, dreads, they're ugly {only exception is neat little rows on very little girls).
ReplyDeleteOn top of it all, hair done that way looks dirty and, in most cases, is. RG III? His is not a look that cries "Handsome." Of course, the DC pundits disregarded his dreaded dreads last year because
he was winning and because he is, after all, a pleasant, intelligent young man. (You don't suppose his race had something to do with their lack of criticism about his looks, do you? Nah.)However, the truth that needs sdpeaking is that he needs a little help in the looks department, and he'd do well to start by ditching the dreads.
The shaved head look is cleaner, but for men of all races, it's almost always a bad look since most guys have knobs and bumps and some have rolls of fat on their scalps. They should keep whatever hair thery have snd if need be keep it trimmed very short.
Many black women wear wigs.
ReplyDeleteOprah wears the iconic Swiss singer Tina Turner's style of wig:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEYgeZP_J0g
You see it so seldom now, that I think the big Angela Davis Afro looks better.
ReplyDeleteNot sure if that is some kind of "White Thing," but I think black people look better with their natural hair.
Maybe it is the fact that the traditional style has been away so long it looks "fresh" now.
I'm as reactionary as the next Isteve commenter, but I draw the line at restricting traditionally black hair styles. In the search for institutionalized racism, false positives are the usual result -- so much so that true positives, i.e., real live racism may be lost in the mix. Restricting cornrows and dreads is obviously racist. Not every black kid wants to be a businessman. (I'm okay with business schools churning out conformist white-acting blacks, if that will make them more successful.) If I were a black father, I would encourage Ichabod Crane Jr. to go with a style that work well naturally with black hair -- dreads, cornrows, or afro.
ReplyDeleteI'm not a hair stylist or a fashionista but I read once that hair (white people's hair at least) is easier to form into dreadlocks when unwashed? Or once it's formed into dreads it should be left like that for long periods of time?
ReplyDeleteI don't have an opinion on dreadlocked blacks but when I see a white person with dreads I want to turn a firehose on 'em.
Wash 'em down.
it seems like every college and pro football team has a black guy with flowing dreadlocks...is that a thing they scout for now?
ReplyDeleteWith those rules, would Thomas Sowell be prohibited from attending class?
ReplyDeleteI've noticed that black women with natural hair/dreadlocks tend to be smarter/more hardworking than average--though the reverse isn't necessarily true.
What amazes me about dreadlocks and cornrows is the complicated and time consuming process it is to clean hair so styled, yet many blacks still go with those styles.
ReplyDeleteSome students go to black colleges to live out the black radical dream (e.g., Spike), others to be as bourgeois as they wanna be without feeling like they are Acting White (there's an aspect of that in Spike, too).
ReplyDeleteOk, lost in all this regarding all of these historically black colleges is...how good are they academically versus more "mainstream" 4yr universities?
ALSO, how come so few of these historically black universities never ever seem to produce a ton of amazing graduates in the fields of mathematics; physics; chemistry; physical sciences; et al?
In other words, within non-black oriented studies but more "mainstream" disciplines, primarily among the sciences and mathematics? You just dont see black colleges at the top or even in the middle of those universities that are leading the way towards amazing innovative breakthroughs in these fields, why is that?
How often to you hear of enterprising students saying "I'm gonna major in pre-med so I can one day help a research team that will provide a major breakthrough in defeating heart disease and cancer, therefore I'd better get cracking and send in my application to Howard or Morehouse."
That never happens. Only one reasonable conclusion to come to: These "black" colleges aren't all that regarding disciplines that are deemed as "too white" based (e.g. Medicine; Mathematics; Physics; Physical Sciences; etc)
And since some of these universities have been in existence for well over a century, it's time to ask the question why is that? Why are these types of schools seldom ever if not never in point of fact at the top of leading the way in academic fields such as math and science?
Why?
In several ancient cultures, long hair was worn for spiritual reasons, status, and as an identifier by free men. Slaves and prisoners were shaven.
ReplyDeleteI've noticed that black women with natural hair/dreadlocks tend to be smarter/more hardworking than average--though the reverse isn't necessarily true.
ReplyDeleteBS. More point of fact, those black women that average higher IQs than their brethren tend to be lighter in skin tone/complexion (similar case w/BM in general). Those BW also tend to wear their hair more akin to WW in general. It's a totally bogus observation anyway and can't be verified much either way.
Although: You might want to say what's not been said but is more the elephant in the room. Why does everyone think that a lot of BW are trying to wear their hair long like white women? Why are the sistas trying to act white regarding hair length/style?
Take a guess, people. Come on. Answer's staring us in the face. Take a guess. Why are they "whitening" their hair style? (for the most part, that is) Drop the bogus syllepsis. The answer is staring us (and the BW) in the face.
In several ancient cultures, long hair was worn for spiritual reasons, status, and as an identifier by free men. Slaves and prisoners were shaven.
ReplyDeleteThat was then, waaaayyy back then. Lots of things were in vogue 10,000yrs ago. Self defecation was "in" and "cool" back then. Whacking women over the head with a club and dragging them back to the cave/lair was the "in" thing to do in neanderthal times. So what?
This is right now. 2013. Times have loonnnng changed. Time to get with the program.
My fave black hairstyle is Bantu Knots, a/k/a "cat turds".
ReplyDeleteSomewhat off topic, but interestingly, Hampton's women's volleyball team is mostly made up of eastern European and Latin American white girls. I guess they can't find many sistahs who are competitive at volleyball.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.hamptonpirates.com/roster.aspx?path=vball&
"In several ancient cultures, long hair was worn"
ReplyDeleteBut did men have longer hair than women? For example, in the 1950s, men wore their hair short and women wore it moderate or piled high. In the 1960s, both sexes shifted toward wearing it long and down. It's rare but to see the male norm be longer than the female norm, but it could be among, say, Indian holy men. But across the whole group, it seems more common among Africans.
But across the whole group, it seems more common among Africans.
ReplyDeleteWay way way way wait. Hold it. Are you also considering Northern Africa as well? Because generally the hair is more in line with European styles and modes.
So perhaps sub-saharan African nations is more apt here.
Hampton's women's volleyball team is mostly made up of eastern European and Latin American white girls.
ReplyDeleteLaugh. The girls just heard "scholarship to play in America". Little did they know...
But did men have longer hair than women?
ReplyDeletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_hair#Maximum_hair_length
I really liked the clip. Spike Lee probably could have made some decent musicals instead of the crappy movies that actually followed (with the possible exception of "Do the Right Thing")
ReplyDeleteYes, my wife has been disappointed by the lack of musical numbers in Spike Lee movies in the quarter century since School Daze.
ReplyDeleteBlack women can grow hair quite long, even many sub-Saharan descent ones.
ReplyDeleteIf you look at photos from the 19th century this is quite evident even among quite dark-complected black women.
In the 17th century, there appeared to be a trend for men to wear long hair in the belief that it would be seen as 'dashing, sensitive, handsome, flowing etc - essentially the myth of man as a romantic hero.
ReplyDeleteAs we all know, long hair is a pain to upkeep, hence the trend in the 17th century for long wigs - look at portraits of 17th century worthies such as Newton or Voltaire. The long wig almost became fetishised in itself as a a kind of helmet or cap even to top off an idealized look.
By Victorian times, things turned full circle. The ideal of manliness was all 'stiff upper lip' no-nonsense and practical, none of the romantic cavalier stuff. Hence the short back and sides haircuts of the times.
A white woman who adopted an African girl started a blog about caring for her hair: Chocolate Hair Vanilla Care. She had a post a while back about the unsolicited hair care advice she gets from black American women when she's out in public with her daughter.
ReplyDeleteThere seems to be a non-trivial number of African girls adopted by white American church-goers. It will be interesting to see the cultural impact these girls will have when the grow up. Perhaps they will carry heartland values with them when they take their places at elite schools.
Black women's hair is complicated; I'm only beginning to grasp the nuances of the subject. I think I picked up quantum mechanics in less time.
ReplyDeleteI think they usually look better with natural hair, although I find black women generally less attractive regardless due to their facial features. I'm a fan of the cavewoman-esque Afro, worn here by Beyonce's sister:
http://blog-afronoya.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/solange-knowles-avec-sa-coiffure-afro.jpg
Not a fan of the bulbous Angela Davis black power 'fro. It looks cartoonish and oddly unnatural.
I also like long braids. Beyonce's sister again:
http://lh3.ggpht.com/-wo1qPkTHnlE/UZApPKvCBZI/AAAAAAAAGCc/VnZ4jE8pq8E/s640/solange-knowles-long-ponytail-braids-twists-chic-edgy-funky-black-275-e1339081971625.jpg
(note her Caucasoid facial features which make her more attractive, imo)
I think they usually look better with natural hair, although I find black women generally less attractive regardless due to their facial features.
ReplyDeleteSub-Saharan African women usually have bad facial features, little to no hair, horrible body types, primitive matriarchal mannerisms and the black skin (which is extremely dark).
The most beautiful women with dark skin tend to be Indian. Their skin color and tone is brown, instead of black. Their hair texture is anywhere between straight, wavy or curly, and it's usually medium length at least. Their facial features are Caucasoid. They are also South Asian, and hence part of Asia (though near the Middle East more).
The girl Nina Davuluri, the recent Indian-American who won Miss USA, tends to represent this type. Melinda Shankar also represents this type, but she's a Canadian actress. Both are "white girls in brown skin".
I attended a academic conference at the Center for Hellenic Studies in Washington, DC one time. The pages and interns working there were all from Howard. They lurked around listening to some of the papers, asked us various questions about learning Ancient Greek, etc. In line with Steve's radical vs. bourgeois dichotomy, perhaps its redundant to mention that there was nary a dredlock, cornrow, or afro to be seen in the bunch.
ReplyDeleteGood hair = Straight Caucasian hair.
ReplyDeleteMedium hair = Wavy/Curly biracial hair.
Bad hair = No hair, going bald or extremely tight and small kinky sub-Saharan black African hair.
"There seems to be a non-trivial number of African girls adopted by white American church-goers. It will be interesting to see the cultural impact these girls will have when the grow up. Perhaps they will carry heartland values with them when they take their places at elite schools."
ReplyDeleteAre these the "heartland values" type of church-goers, or good liberals? Liberals go to church too; they just hear sermons about tolerance and globalism instead of sin and hellfire. Just asking because I don't know. The traditional church-goers I know who adopted somehow managed to find American kids of their own race, but I hear that's not always easy.
"...the Horizon Science Academy in Lorain, Ohio, sent a draft policy home to parents that proposed a ban on "Afro-puffs and small twisted braids." It, too, quickly apologized and withdrew the wording."
ReplyDeleteThe muslims who run Gulen's charter schools are pretty conservative about hair and dress. Big surprise there. I wonder if Shakwante's mom would be cool with a hijab to cover those dreads.
"Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteHampton's women's volleyball team is mostly made up of eastern European and Latin American white girls."
Volley ball is for tall white girls who have been muscled off the basketball court by black girls.
Lacrosse is for white kids who.have been kicked off the soccer field by Mexican kids.
This is the only racist joke I know:
ReplyDeleteQ: Why did God give black people rhythm?
A: Well he had to do something for them after the way he fucked up their hair!
In several ancient cultures, long hair was worn for spiritual reasons, status, and as an identifier by free men. Slaves and prisoners were shaven.
ReplyDeleteLong hair (and sometimes beards) could also be a sign of male virility and power in the ancient world.
In the Hebrew scriptures there's a passage where the propher Elisha gets teased by some boys for having a bald head, so he promptly uses divine power to call up two bears to maul them. (believe it or not, that's in there)
In Atlanta the newest crime is for thieves to steal a car somewhere, drive it through the front window of a black beauty supply store and then have a mad scramble to grab all of the expensive hair extension packages on the shelves there:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.cbsatlanta.com/story/14732526/smash-and-grab-robbers
http://www.cbsatlanta.com/story/15356748/poli
I really wish they'd catch the Nordics that keep doing this, they're taking anywhere from $10K to $50K worth of products off shelf each time they strike.
Women's hair has a higher mean diameter, even in short-haired populations like New Guineans. I've also seen claims that women's hair has a higher growth rate and a longer final length, but I've yet to find any studies on this subject.
ReplyDeleteI wrote up a post on the evolution of long hair that may be of interest to your readers:
http://evoandproud.blogspot.ca/2013/08/great-hair-and-how-it-evolved.html
Black women with relaxed hair don´t look natural, let alone with Beyonce style wigs. They could learn to style their natural hair to improve their looks, as they do in Africa.
ReplyDeleteColorism is rife in the African-American community, as indeed it is throughout Latin America. My Peruvian daughter-in-law accepts it unembarrassingly as one of the facts of life. Or at least she did until she had been here awhile. She wants her babies to be white, the whiter the better.
ReplyDeleteThere seems to be a non-trivial number of African girls adopted by white American church-goers.
ReplyDeleteYes there most certainly does. Begs the question, why is that? Why don't they simply adopt a white child?
It will be interesting to see the cultural impact these girls will have when the grow up.
Next to none at all, actually will occur.
Perhaps they will carry heartland values with them when they take their places at elite schools.
No, the actual thing is, they will be caught in a dilemma. Do they "adopt" the natural culture of African Americans since the more they come into contact with them they will be pressured to do so, OR do they try to remain in whitey's culture and "act white" the rest of their lives?
If they're raised by whites its unlikely they wont have an ebonics dialect but speak English as if they're white, so that right there is a 'strike' vs them culturally, should they decide mingle with fellow blacks.
Twill be interesting either way as it all pans out. Of course, there's not enough to make a dent of difference on the total US black population. So it's all moot anyway.
There is not very much 'Caucasoid' blood in the Knowles girls. Both their parents are black.
ReplyDeleteAlso, those features are Afrotypic, especially the little nose. I think a lot of commenters here don't know what African features look like. It's not all alek wek, you know.
anonymous @ 9/25/13, 7:51 PM
ReplyDeleteALSO, how come so few of these historically black universities never ever seem to produce a ton of amazing graduates in the fields of mathematics; physics; chemistry; physical sciences; et al?
The main issue is that there are relatively few black STEM graduates, whether they went to mainstream colleges and universities, or to historically black colleges or universities.
A better way to phrase your question would be: how do historically black universities do compared to mainstream universities with regard to black STEM graduates? Historically black colleges and universities [HCBU] measure up at rather well, at least in quantity, in producing STEM graduates.
From Igniting Potential, a publication of the Southern Education Organization:
Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs) are a vital resource for efforts to increase the Black presence in science,technology, engineering and mathematics (STEM). In 2000, almost one out of every four African Americans receiving a bachelor’s degree graduated from an HBCU. In 2000, HBCUs graduated 40 percent or more of all African Americans who received degrees in physics, chemistry, astronomy, environmental sciences, mathematics and biology. In almost every STEM field, HBCUs lead the nation’s larger,better-equipped colleges in producing Black graduates. The National Science Foundation has found that African Americans who graduate from HBCU undergraduate institutions in STEM are more likely to go to graduate school and complete their doctoral degrees than African American undergraduates from other institutions.
Since a black STEM graduate from a mainstream undergraduate program is less likely to get a Ph.D. than the holder of an undergraduate STEM degree from a historically black university [HCBU], this would suggest that the HCBU doesn't do badly in the quality department, either.
There is a recent study which suggests that blacks admitted to elite colleges and universities are more likely to abandon plans of graduating in STEM fields than if they had attended less elite colleges. In order to keep up a good grade average, they slide down to an easier major. So, going to a historically black college or university [HBCU] for a STEM major doesn't sound like such a bad idea for a black interested in a STEM degree.
@Anonymous of 9/25/13, 8:00 PM
ReplyDeleteI went to a large predominantly black high school. The dumbest black girls all tended to wear straight plastic hair, either clipped onto their (short) actual hair or just over it as a wig. Sometimes this fake hair came in blonde or even neon colors. Those who wore their own hair but straightened it also tended to dye it (often red or blue). Almost none of them wore their hair natural or in dreads.
(My wife--who wears her hair natural--has pointed out some of the interesting overlap between hardcore punk and ghetto black women's fashion.)
The smartest black girls, meanwhile, tended to wear their hair either straightened, natural, or in dreads, but almost none of them wore hair that was obviously not their own, plus almost none of them colored their actual hair. This was also true of most of the black girls at both colleges I attended (one in Arizona and one in Ohio).
When I moved to L.A. to work in the film industry, the more accomplished black women behind the scenes often wore their hair natural or in dreads.
The number one reason most black women straighten their hair is that it makes it easier to deal with. That's important when you have to get up in the morning for work or school. Dreads take some time to maintain, but you don't get "bed head" with dreads the way you do with an afro.
Black women tend to be very confident in their looks, including their looking black, which (apart from just my ample personal experience with black women) is the reason I don't buy the idea that many of them wear straight hair in an effort to look whiter--though a few of them probably do.
There are also those crunchy black women, who tend to be higher IQ but real into hippie-dippie 1970s stuff (think Erykah Badu), and for them being proud of their black hair is a Thing. The dumber ghetto girls are more indifferent about being "proud" of their natural black hair.
Another thing to consider is the way black women of various intellectual/economic stripes tend to spend their money. Chemically altering your hair or buying wigs or weave can become expensive. The smarter black girls realize it's not a wise investment so they either wear their hair natural or just flat iron it once in a while. The dumber ghetto girls, meanwhile, are more likely to spend what little money they have on stuff like and hair nails (another area where the dumber black girls tend to have the less natural look).
"Yes, my wife has been disappointed by the lack of musical numbers in Spike Lee movies in the quarter century since School Daze."
ReplyDeleteyou should review "bamboozled"
it's an awful movie and i feel bad for suggesting you watch it...but it's fascinating to see the insanity of spike lee's racial paranoia in fullest bloom.
and hey, as savion glover says, "as long as the hoofin' is real..."
Since a black STEM graduate from a mainstream undergraduate program is less likely to get a Ph.D. than the holder of an undergraduate STEM degree from a historically black university [HCBU], this would suggest that the HCBU doesn't do badly in the quality department, either.
ReplyDeleteYou didnt accurately answer my question in total. What percentage compared to other minorities are blacks represented in not only STEM but also medicine and Physics as well as other physical but not STEM sciences? It's a faiir question. The fact that you dont directly address this aspect suggests that the answer is not very large. Certainly, we would hear of these numerous blacks who were scientists, physicians, etc. Certainly the mainstream media would be promoting them as often as possible.
But as you prefaced your main points, STEM = tons of blacks is somewhat an oxymoron. Another apt question would be to compare minorities across the board.
In America, are there more STEM grads who are black or Jewish? That's a fair question since both are a minority and the total number of blacks in America greatly outnumbers Jewish Americans. Which is a greater percentage of STEM as well as the medical and non STEM scientific fields at large? The fact that you don't really address this strongly suggests that the answer is very low, perhaps not more than say, 2% of the total STEM and other highly advanced degrees.
The smartest black girls, meanwhile, tended to wear their hair either straightened, natural, or in dreads, but almost none of them wore hair that was obviously not their own, plus almost none of them colored their actual hair.
The "smartest black girls" that sounds an oxymoron. You mean compared to Rachel Jeantel? Then I guess so.
Black women tend to be very confident in their looks, including their looking black,
Some of that is a facade. Have to distinguish between an overt personality which tends to mask inadequacies and just plain uppity.
which (apart from just my ample personal experience with black women) is the reason I don't buy the idea that many of them wear straight hair in an effort to look whiter--though a few of them probably do.
Again, part of their racially conscious ideology (somewhat akin to Germany in 30s) is that to admit that they like something "non black" means almost automatically that they are race traitors to the cause.
MORE than a few, perhaps almost HALF do. There is a reason for it. Why dont we just stop beating around it. There are numerous websites and blogs about black women lamenting that the sistas are losing out "their" guys to white girls. Just be honest enough to admit that, it would help.
Obviously they're not going to come out and say it straight up, but come on. Why bother with concolene, porcelana, etc other beauty aids to "lighten" themselves? What Michael Jackson did was an extreme extreme example, but the point is that several do that sort of thing. Why? To look less dark. Why? Various reasons of course, but chief among them in this day and age is that they are "losing out" so to speak, in getting a genuine legitimate BM (the few who are not in prison, can read about a 10yr old level, can speak reasonably educated without an ebonics dialect, etc) those few BM are now starting to go for other kinds of women (read WW).
To suggest that black women dont at all notice this is ludicrous and asinine. They notice it, they dont tend to like it, and, to some degree, some are starting to "do something" such as lighten up as well as fix their hair up.
Remember Gabby Douglas getting all that flack last yr for wearing her hair in a non black way? And she wasnt even trying to get a boyfriend. Who gave her all that flack? Not white people.
Bottom line: BW enjoy being black but they also tend to have low self esteem IF they start seeing other brothas going for WW. That bothers the hell out of them. Wonder why?
The answer, is staring them, (and us)...in the face.
Anonymous/sin nombre @ 9/26/13, 4:09 PM
ReplyDeleteWhat percentage compared to other minorities are blacks represented in not only STEM but also medicine and Physics as well as other physical but not STEM sciences?
S=science
T=technology
E=engineering
M=mathematics
Given this basic definition for STEM, I find your categories, such as "other physical but not STEM sciences," as rather problematic to parse. For example, you have STEM as a subset of the sciences, when in fact the sciences are a subset of STEM.
It's a faiir question.[The question which is in boldface above.] The fact that you dont directly address this aspect suggests that the answer is not very large.
I didn't directly answer that question because you didn't directly ask it. Nor am I going to directly answer it now because, as I have pointed out, the question is poorly phrased. Nonetheless, at the beginning of my initial comment I believe I addressed the basic content of your question when I stated the following:
"The main issue is that there are relatively few black STEM graduates, whether they went to mainstream colleges and universities, or to historically black colleges or universities."
But as you prefaced your main points, STEM = tons of blacks is somewhat an oxymoron. Another apt question would be to compare minorities across the board.
You need to read more carefully. I stated that while there are relatively few black STEM graduates, HCBUs do a better job then mainstream institutions in producing them, and provided the documentation.
Ciao.
To the poster at 9/26/13, 12:30 PM,
ReplyDeletehave you ever seen a picture of Beyoncé's mother? She definitely more white than black. Beyoncé got in trouble with some blacks for even mentioning her French Creole ancestry.
You need to read more carefully. I stated that while there are relatively few black STEM graduates, HCBUs do a better job then mainstream institutions in producing them, and provided the documentation.
ReplyDeleteWhile reading your lengthy response another question arises: What is the major academic emphasis for these HCBUs? In other words, is STEM based AND ALSO MEDICINE the majority of their graduates? Are these colleges turning out mostly STEM AND MEDICINE based graduates? The answer would most likely be: NO.
I also have mentioned medicine, a non STEM discipline, which you did NOT address, for a reason. The medicine field is a very high IQ field. Some of the highest in US...or the right side of the bell curve will be well represented in the field of medicine.
I notice you also ignored the comparison of blacks to other minorities such as JEWS to see which minorities are well represented in STEM AND MEDICINE disciplines.
Chiao
Whatever. Not saying anti-semetic to ignore the comparison of black percentage within STEM and Medicine fields to other minorities including Jews. Guess it appears obvious why you wouldn't want to make that comparison since perhaps one minority is well represented while another minority won't be hardly noticed at all.
You have a nice day too.
Sub-Saharan African women usually have bad facial features,
ReplyDeleteAgreed. I have a strong preference for Caucasoid facial features.
little to no hair,
What are you talking about?
horrible body types,
I like their body type. I tend to prefer curvier women (as in actual feminine curves, not as a euphemism for fat). Unfortunately, most American women are overweight or obese, and the situation is even worse among blacks.
primitive matriarchal mannerisms
I don't know what this means. You seem to be referencing the notion of matriarchal prehistorical societies, a discredited fiction.
Ghetto black women are often surly, but that's a cultural thing. Are Anglo-Saxon women inherently masculine, feminist termagants? No, that's just a product of contemporary bourgeois mores in the Anglosphere.
and the black skin (which is extremely dark).
"Extremely dark" skin is common only among some SSA groups. It's rare among African Americans.
The most beautiful women with dark skin tend to be Indian.
I agree.
There is not very much 'Caucasoid' blood in the Knowles girls. Both their parents are black.
One can be considered "black" in the US with less than 1/4 African ancestry (e.g. Benjamin Jealous). Furthermore, Wikipedia lists their mother as mixed race Creole. Thus it would not surprise me if the Knowles sisters had less than 50% African ancestry (though I'm not asserting they necessarily do).
Also, those features are Afrotypic, especially the little nose. I think a lot of commenters here don't know what African features look like. It's not all alek wek, you know.
There's lots of genetic diversity among sub-Saharan African groups, hence there is no such thing as a general set of "African features". However, most African Americans get their black ancestry from west African groups, particularly the Yoruba, so they are hardly a representative sample of SSA.
I'm American, and I lived in Nigeria for several years. I know what west Africans look like, and I know what hybrids look like. Solange obviously has substantial white ancestry.
Compare her to Jimi Hendrix:
https://nzfilmfreak.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/jimi-hendrix-in-1967.jpg
Hendrix's father was half black, the other half being mostly white. I can't find any info on his mother's ancestry, but here's a photo of the family:
http://www.queenscorner.com/pict158.htm
She's obviously much lighter than the half-black dad. Hendrix was no more than 75% black, and probably substantially less than that given his mother's skin tone. And yet he has a much more distinctly African facial structure than the Knowles sisters.
Solange: http://sandrarose.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/Solange-Knowles-in-London-4-SPL.jpg?42e305
Beyonce: http://www.crushable.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/beyonce2.jpg
We'll have to agree to disagree, Anon who's lived in Nigeria and apparently knows nothing of the ethnic groups living there. The Knowles come from a fecund and fabulist family tree in the region and you just don't know what you're talking about regarding their ancestry.
ReplyDeleteThey're as black as Pam Grier, who's pretty black.
There is not very much 'Caucasoid' blood in the Knowles girls. Both their parents are black.
ReplyDeleteWRONG. Both have a lot of Caucasian ancestry. You have never obviously seen a full-blooded sub-Saharan black African.
Also, those features are Afrotypic, especially the little nose.
No. Little, straight and long noses are Caucasian.
I think a lot of commenters here don't know what African features look like. It's not all alek wek, you know.
Ummm, most of them DO look like Alek Wek. A woman like Iman is Somali and that's part of the Horn of East Africa, which is different, since most of them are part Caucasian through the Arab paternal line.
On the whole skin tone and facial features issue, the lighter one is on average and in general the finer and more delicate indeed the more Caucasoid his facial features, but this is a hundred times more apparent if the father is white.
ReplyDeleteWhy? Because children tend to resemble their fathers more, despite being both the father's and the mother's. "Black" faces tend to come out more if the father is black. Nevertheless since the mother is Caucasian or Asian, it tends to be more of a cute or soft "black face".
One thing I’ve noticed is that when a sub-Saharan black (negroid) mixes with a white person, or Asian person, it really depends if the father or mother is black. Most children despite being both the father’s and the mother’s, tend to resemble the father more in appearance on average and in general.
If the mother is black, the kids come out lighter in skin tone (pale yellow) and having “white faces”, that girl’s skin when exposed to daily sunlight ends up a deep yellow. If the father is black, the kids come out slightly darker in skin tone (deep yellow) but have “cute black” faces (like it has small, cute black features and the face is more proportioned) and when the girls get exposed to daily sunlight (think sports, fitness, water activities) their skin gets darker (like ending up yellow-brown). Nevertheless, both mulatto girl types have curly/wavy hair and tend to have small-medium builds with a pear or hourglass shape (almost never an apple or a ruler).
The BM (sub-Saharan Negroid)/WF mulatta girls I’ve seen end up looking like the following American actresses (when exposed to daily sunlight):
- Meagan Tandy
- Keke Palmer
- Faune A. Chambers
- Kerry Washington
On the other hand, the British actress Thandie Newton has a black mother and a white father, and she has pale yellow skin and a white face.
But yes, in general and as a whole, African-American women are obsessed with weaves/wigs, hair straightening and the like. They are also mostly descended from West Africans.
ReplyDelete1st generation exceptional African women are a different bunch, and can be divided between West African, Central African and South African. On the other hand, North African women are just Caucasoid Arab (Muslim) and East African women from the Horn (Eritrea, Somalia, Ethiopia) are like yellow-brown skinned dolls with Arab Caucasoid faces. East African women not from the Horn though tend to look blacker.
Now if 1st generation African women (exceptional and rich high-status types) moved to a non-African environment and nation for a long period of time and they have 2nd and 3rd generation African children, then they may "regress towards the mean" and they may start aping "white beauty standards".
Caucasian features such as long straight hair, fine/delicate Caucasoid facial features, a small to medium body size and the like, start to matter for 2nd and 3rd generational ones, unlike 1st generational ones.
I don't typically see wigs and skin bleaching for the recent arrivals. Surgery for the face (think nose and lips) is also not an epidemic among recent 1st generation exceptional African women.
This whole "good hair" vs. "bad hair" debate starts flapping its wings when they start assimilating. I think it's because in Manospherian terms, other women (e.g. white European women, Arab Caucasoid women, East Asian Oriental women, Southeast Asian women, certain mestizas and whatnot) have higher sexual market value and marriage market value to most men out there and hence they start emulating those standards.
"...And yet he has a much more distinctly African facial structure than the Knowles sisters."
ReplyDeleteThey have this newfangled thing now called "plastic surgery", Champ.
Here is an excerpt from an Italian web page describing physiological basis for longer hair in women - Google it to see the longer original article:
ReplyDeleteThe hair cycle is controlled by sex steroids. Not by hormones circulating in the blood but by hormones that are produced within the follicle itself. Dihydrotestosterone inhibits the Adenil cyclase enzyme, while Estrone increases it. A follicle in the anagen phase makes a "physiological attempt" to reach the catagen stage and then the telogen stage.