April 21, 2008


From Channel 7 News in Denver;

Parents Fight Over Which Gang Toddler Should Join

Police: Mother A Crip, Father A Westside Baller

COMMERCE CITY, Colo. -- A couple fighting about which gang their 4-year-old toddler should join caused a public disturbance that resulted in the father's arrest, Commerce City police said Thursday.

On Saturday, Joseph Manzanares stormed into the Hollywood Video store where his girlfriend worked, threatened to kill her and knocked over several video displays and even a computer, Commerce City police Sgt. Joe Sandoval said.

After he ran out of the store, police were called and the 19-year-old was arrested at his home.

His girlfriend told police that they had been arguing about the upbringing of their son and which gang he should belong to. The teen mother, who is black, is a member of the Crips. Manzanares is Hispanic and belongs to the Westside Ballers gang, the woman said.

"They have different ideas on how the baby should be raised. Basically, she said they cannot agree on which gang the baby would 'claim,'" Sandoval said.

My published articles are archived at iSteve.com -- Steve Sailer


Anonymous said...

Westside Baller here, keepin' it real.

Learned how to bang over at gnxp.com.

Anonymous said...

I wonder how they managed to put aside the Latino vs. Black gangs rivalry to have and attempt to raise a kid.

Anonymous said...


Keep in mind they were 15 at the time. Young love conquers all.

Anonymous said...

It's like Jurassic Park: life will find a way...(to knock boots)

Anonymous said...

More proof that another benefit of immigration is diversity of choice! Why, nowadays families don't just have all different kinds of ethnic restaurants to choose from but different kinds of gangs as well. Back in the bad ol' days before the (immigration) flood, that poor kid would have had no choice but to be a Crip. Today, his future is limitless!

Anonymous said...

Montagues and Capulets, anyone?

Anonymous said...

Diversity makes America stronger.


Anonymous said...

Montagues and Capulets, anyone?

Nah, not even West Side Story.

This is dumbed down to an almost subhuman level.

TGGP said...

One of the few occasions in which I scooped Steve.

Anonymous said...

"I wonder how they managed to put aside the Latino vs. Black gangs rivalry to have and attempt to raise a kid."

Maybe because the reported extent of the rivalry is sensational and overstated?

Anonymous said...

Another good example (as if one were needed) of why it is a bad idea to have children with someone outside your own ethnic group.

Anonymous said...

In many mixed marriages, the parents will expose the child to both traditions, and let them decide when they are old enough!

Anonymous said...

This raises an interesting question about ethinic self-identification.

While most black/white kids seem to to identify with black culture while asian/white usually favor the white culture. Most hispanic/white kids I've met favor the white slide somewhat less.

What do native-born black/hispanic do?

Anonymous said...

They should compromise and have the kid join the Aryan Brotherhood.

Anonymous said...

It looks like someone beat me to it.

Looks like Romeo and Juliet dying wasn't such a tragedy after all.

m said...

If given the choice you have to go with the Westside Ballers- not even close. The Crips are sooo played, 80's style gang- no thanks, not for my kid.

Anonymous said...

I should have thought the debate was over being a Republican or Democrat. Hispanics are "natural" Republicans, you know.

Anonymous said...

there is less rivalry between blacks and hispanics outside of CA. many of the hispanic gangs outside of LA have only been around since the 80's or 90's and are basically composed of the hispanic version of wiggers. also most western cites outside of CA have few blacks, so they aren't much of a threat.

Anonymous said...

These people are disgusting human beings. They should be deported and/or jailed for the next 50-60 years and their child should be sent to live with a Chinese family. Losers like this are ruining our country.

Republican Patriot

mnuez said...

Because no one else will, I'll step into the arena here to state the disagreeable yet likely possibility that 'there but for the grace of God go you'.

When you're stuck in a really shitty hood where something like 50% of your people end up in jail at some point and where your economic opportunities are pretty near nil and where violence rages all around you it's the FITTEST who survive by smartly banding together to work for their common good in what we would call "a gang".

Were we however to live in a more equitable society.... well, just look at Europe. The fact that the US is one of the only civilized nation without universal healthcare and pretty much the only one where the POOR are hated rather than the rich, might have something to do with the fact that we lead the world in both straight numbers and relative percentages of prisoners for the population. I could go on with numbers and relevant facts but my perception is that not in ten readers here care a whit for such things - which is a tragedy. The isteve community is one of the smartest, intellectually freest and most well-read in the blogosphere wilds and it would be great if all of that extended just a few paces past paleoconservatism.


mikej said...

I'm amazed by the lack of empathy for this poor child! Will the Crips accept a mestizo outcross? Will the Westside Ballers accept a black outcross? Will the poor boy be short-changed in drug deals? Will he be condemned to a life of meaningless drive-by shootings without the support of a caring peer group? How can you be so unfeeling?

Obviously, we need a new federal program to mentor such children. I say this even though I, as a white boy, am obvioulsy disqualified from the leadership post. It'll probably cost 8 or 10 trillion dollars over the next decade, but we must do it for the children.

Anonymous said...

I have to go with the father on this one.Sure being a Crip offers a lot of advantages,but the reason why every soccer mom in L.A. is pushing her children,getting them to take all these special cram courses(hot-wiring a car,basic knife fighting,et al) and just generally competing like mad to get their kid into the Westside Ballers is because membership in this gang is practically a 1st class ticket to the Good Life. America is changing,and future gangsters will have to change with it. The skills and social contacts one makes as a Westside Baller will aid the child throughout his non-working gangbanging life! Getting paid,getting off,getting his "freak on",-a dazzling world of possibilities opens up to the child who earns the coveted and not-all-that-painful "WB" brand on his arm!! But the question is,in this mad dash for status,are parents pushing too hard? Is it really best for the child who is staying up late learning to represent? Does the child whose day is structured so carefully--learning how to buy and sell drugs all day,after a quick dinner,a long night of shooting dice,weekends spent learning the finer points of keeping ones "bitch" in line,--does he miss out on important aspects of,well,just being a kid? What about time just to sit and stare at the stars?(I mean without "huffing" gasoline fumes first,of course) Time to dream. Time to just be a regular kid? To the parents,and the kids,tho,the sacrifice seems well worth it.

Anonymous said...

ABC News: Mafia Is Biggest Business in Italy:



Russian Mafia:



Nice to overlook all the crime and horror committed by European criminal gangs.

BTW, has anyone heard more about Neil Bushes herpes he caught from the prostitutes hired by the Chinese military to keep him happy?

I haven't heard anything recently about Jeb Bush's children, all of whom have criminal records ranging from drug crimes to stalking.

Oh, hey, isn't great to hear about the FLDS, nice group of white guys who sexually enslave women starting as young girls to have their kids.

Interesting hearing about "blood atonement," FLDS men have the right to kill their wives if they commit a sin. Good to know that there is some commonality between fundamentalist Eurpoean Americans and members of fundamentalist Arab sects.

Anonymous said...

"The isteve community is one of the smartest, intellectually freest and most well-read in the blogosphere wilds and it would be great if all of that extended just a few paces past paleoconservatism."

I'll go for this. Maybe we take up a collection so that you can get that liver transplant or whatever it is you have your eye on and you stop posting poorly reasoned bilge. Deal? Seriously, this would be a win/win.

Anonymous said...

Mnuez, yes, indeed, look at Europe.

In the areas with large black or North African immigrant communities, the police themselves are afraid to tread.

As I understand it, between the unemployment, violence and occasional rioting, things almost look like, uh, Africa or North Africa.

Anonymous said...

Mnuez, a straight comparison with Europe just isn't fair for the US. The US has far more blacks and latin americans then Europe. Go look up social statistics on non-market dominant minorities (pretty much non-east asian minorities) in Europe and Canada and you'll find that their US counterparts don't look so bad in comparison. Compare black europeans to black americans, and then you are comparing apples to apples. Differential demographics is the cause of most greater US social problems vis a vis Europe, and if Europe had our demographics they'd have much the same problems as well.

mnuez said...

Aw, you're lettin me on Nelson! For 10K (price negotiable) I'll never post on isteve again. Markets in everything my good friend, markets in everything. Capitalists may be willing to sell you the rope needed to hang them but Socialists will sell their souls for the rope needed to climb to Capitalist levels of financial success, aint it.

Anonymous said...

I've come to agree with scottynx over time. Yup, diversity is the reason we can't have a Euro-style welfare state. Which means you paleocons are stuck with a nasty choice: immigration or socialism? I'll take socialism any time of day; it seems to work pretty well in Sweden, and that's one of the reasons I support immigration restriction.

I do think mnuez has a point that joining a gang may be the best option in many cases (it's not that easy to get out of the ghetto through education, etc.), and in fact many American ethnic groups such as Irish, Jews, and Italians formed ethnic gangs when they first came here.

Of course, having the wrong skin color presents an extra barrier to assimilation (thanks, Dixie), so we may not be able to absorb Hispanics as well.

Anonymous said...

Nobody seems to get what this is all about. That is the problem with being white: whiteness in the USA is ethnicity writ so large that it makes ethnicity invisible or seem "external" to its constituents.

For those non-white parents, gang membership equates to race. The fight is, what race is the kid going to roll with? Who is going to have his back, and who is going to be an outsider?

Only educated whites can be clueless enough to imagine this is something silly or minor. For most human beings on this planet, identity equals survival.

There is a major, major turf war going on between Latinos and Blacks. This is for jobs, neighborhoods, and gang turf. Ultimately for political spoils too.

There is no rainbow coalition of non-whites. Some blacks don't want to believe it, because it will be hard to realize that whites are probably the best friends the blacks have in the world. I kid you not.

Anonymous said...

The 90's were the Bloods. Crips peaked in 2002-5. Tomorrow belongs to the ballers.

Amo la raza; Amo mi raza; Soy leal a la sangre.

Anonymous said...

Well said, getaclue. Scottynx and SFG are correct also. The difference between paleos and liberals is that paleos understand the tribal nature of life and want whites to act in their own tribal interest like all the other tribes, while liberals think they are "above" such concerns and imagine that everyone really wants to be a liberal like them.

The presence of nonwhite groups in America prevents euro-style socialism from emerging here. And in Europe, the growing nonwhite populations will eventually cause socialism to fail.

The future will be more tribal. The liberal whites are dying out due to their low birth rate. In a few generations the only whites left will be fundamentalists and paleos, and they will be as tribal as the non-whites. There won't be a mainstream, just a lot of mutually hostile tribes.

Anonymous said...

SFG said...

I've come to agree with scottynx over time. Yup, diversity is the reason we can't have a Euro-style welfare state. Which means you paleocons are stuck with a nasty choice: immigration or socialism? I'll take socialism any time of day"

Of course, the Swedes have socialism, and it has led to.....immigration. The same spirit that motivates one, will eventually give in to the other. Unless of course the socialism is more, what's the word,....national. Yeah. A national socialism might solve the problem. Somebody ought to try national socialism sometime. What could go wrong?

Anonymous said...

"he teen mother, who is black, is a member of the Crips. Manzanares is Hispanic and belongs to the Westside Ballers gang,"

I guess there aren't any gangs that sing and dance anymore, like there were back in the 50's.

Steve Sailer said...

And whatever happened to those dancing gangs Michael Jackson was in his "Beat It" and "Bad" videos?

Anonymous said...

It seems like a no-brainer - the boy should be a crip. He's half-black and will be physically identifiable as black. I know a woman who has a Mexican father and a black mother, just like this boy, and she just looks like a light-skinded black woman, and identifies as black. You wouldn't guess she's part Hispanic if you didn't know her last name.

Anonymous said...

Well judging from the tot's parents he'd probably just end up graduating high school or getting a GED at best. So it's proabaly a gang or the army for him.

Anonymous said...

Z Z Top's Song "Mexican Blackbird":

If youre down in acuna and you aint up to being alone
Dont spend all your money on just any honey thats grown.
Go find the mexican blackbird and send all your troubles back home.

They all call her her puta cause no one really knows her name.
She works the cantina, dancin and a-lovins her trade.
Her mama was mezcan and her daddy was the ace of spades.

Oh, lets drive that old chrysler down to mexico, boy.
Said, keep your hands on the wheel there.
Oh, it sure is fine, aint it?
Now, ya got it! hand me another one of them brews from back there.
Oh, this is gonna be so good.

Mm, shes hot as a pepper but smooth as a mexican brew.
So head for the border and put in an order or two.
The wings of the blackbird will spread like an eagle for you.

Oh, one more time,
Can you roll me another bull durham, please?
Cant you do it with one hand, boy?