Yesterday in "Who, Whom, Humor," I mentioned an NYT article about a sophomoric commuter college humor newspaper written by sophomores, the San Diego State Koala. Here's the "most recommended" of the Reader's Pick comments:
Liz Chicago Yesterday
The fact that the writers of the Koala will not print their own names on the byline suggests that all involved with the publication realize that the articles are sufficiently offensive that they might negatively affect future job prospects. If people wish to limit the scope of the Koala a simple strategy would be to provide the social feedback that the writers fear: set up a webpage linking their names to the articles. Free speech is protected by the Constitution, as it should be. Anonymity is not.
105 Recommend
I really think we need some in-depth research into what kind of person wants to ruin the lifelong careers of teenagers by making sure their Permanent Records highlight any and all youthful indiscretions against the current and future rules of political correctness.
Were there always huge numbers of people like this out there before social media came along? Or does the new digital technology excite them and exacerbate their worse tendencies? Did the Obama 2012 campaign intentionally encourage them?
Were there always huge numbers of people like this out there before social media came along? Or does the new digital technology excite them and exacerbate their worse tendencies? Did the Obama 2012 campaign intentionally encourage them?
It would be a pretty easy experiment for psych professors to survey students to see who thinks it's a great idea to join the Volunteer Auxiliary Thought Police. What are their demographics? Why are they so hate-filled toward people who get more fun out of life?
The Clash's 1979 song "Clampdown" gives us a pretty persuasive picture of the kind of guy who would bully political dissidents for a paycheck, a cool uniform, and the enjoyment of humiliating somebody face to face:
They put up a poster saying we earn more than you!
When we're working for the clampdown ...
You grow up and you calm down
You're working for the clampdown
You start wearing the blue and brown
You're working for the clampdown
So you got someone to boss around
It makes you feel big now
You drift until you brutalize
You made your first kill now
But the Liz in Chicago types have somewhat different motivations. They deserve careful study.
Posts
102 comments:
Actually if you want a good example of this personality type check out your fan website "Steve Sailer Sucks".
AKAHorace
So we should make sure we figure out how Liz is and publish it widely.
multiculti is the tool of the corporations for increasing profits via flooding the labor supply and dividing the populace. So of course the corporations have molded millions of little brownshirt nazis/ witch hunters/ commie hunters/ fascists.
You see, the aims of the corporations and the plutocrats are always the same--to get richer. But they use different tools over time.
Right now they are using political correctness to depress wages and divide the populace. But during era and nations and historical times, they used different tools and stratgies.
But no matter what time or era or strategies the elite use, there are always willing minions, drones, foot soldiers that can be shaped and used as tools of the elite.
There were plenty of willing nazis to do the will of the Old Money and corporations that created and backed the nazis. And same thing for other fascist regimes. And same thing that happened in the USA several decades ago where there will plenty of warrior drones looking to point out any commies in the USA. All the better to help the rich keep their money.
Same as it ever was. The more things change, the more they stay the same.
Commie-hunters, brownshirts, witch hunters, anti-racist, all same-same.
"I really think we need some in-depth research into what kind of person wants to ruin the lifelong careers of teenagers by making sure their Permanent Records highlight any and all youthful indiscretions against the current and future rules of political correctness."
Well, if I thought "racism" and "sexism" were great evils, I would approve of ruining the lives of college students in order to deter others. I consider modern leftist to be evil, so I would favor ruining the lives of young communists, feminists, and aspiring Al Sharptons. If you're old enough to affect our political, you're old enough to suffer the consequences.
The problem with liberals is that their ideas are wrong, not their methods.
Everyone assume that Brendan Eich's critics were gay. I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't. Perhaps they're just the same sort of people that want to ruin these kids lives' and, in the process, play there own small part in a few minutes hate fest.
America seems to undergo a process of continual cultural death. And it's not driven by the top 1% or 10% or top 20%. It's driven by the short-sighted, unthinking, dumbf+ck mediocrities.
It's not hard to see after a short while. The height, breadth and depth of the bullshit, though, it takes a long time to see.
Message four illustrates message three.
This is a problem of how you believe, not what you believe.
AKAHorace
Some Clash stuff: Terry Chimes was-is an admirer of the late Maggie Thatcher. Chimes was politically the polar opposite of Joe Strummer. Terry Chimes was bona fide working class as opposed to Strummer's upper class background. Strummer was very upset when Chimes quit the Clash. These days, Terry Chimes is the number one Chiropractor in England....... Bill Blizzard and his Men.....
Remember that some of the earliest Americans were the Puritan types looking for witches to burn. It's a part of our society.
Or, it's a bunch of pod people.
Well, they're likely female. You yourself said women are less tolerant of dissent.
My guess is they're the descendants of Women's Temperance Clubs--people who think they are doing God's work (or whatever subs in for God nowadays) by enforcing the right beliefs. Interestingly, they'd probably be horrified to be told they were conformists.
My odious relatives? Probably a good portion, but certainly not all. Chicago has a Jewish population, but not huge.
What's Liz's last name?
Men look to physically fight, women look for social pressure.
So different parts of clampdown.
The Gawker empire's entire financial model is based on wrecking the lives of young people who spout off politically incorrect or simply dumb things on social networks.
I'm a hardcore economic leftist, but the rise of the volunteer thought police/p.c. enforcement industry makes me ill.
For every wrecker there is a Pavlik Morozov!
Two years ago some hockey fans on Twitter wrote racist things about a black player after he scored a big goal against their team. The owner of the player's team blogged:
"I hope they are now publicly identified and pay a huge price for their beliefs. There should be zero tolerance for this kind of hate mongering. Their messages should now stay glued into the algorithms to place a forever warning and a mark upon these people and their actions. They shouldn't be able to escape their keystrokes."
Off-Topic: Former President George W. Bush called the achievement gap between white and black children “a national scandal” on Thursday and urged both parties to come together to address it as the central civil rights issue of the modern era.
I always thought that line from Clampdown was "They put up a poster saying we are robbing you!" I still cling to my mondegreens. And I still sing with Dylan as if were saying "split up on the docks that night boh agreeing it was best." Which is better than "split up on a dark, sad night..."
Remember that some of the earliest Americans were the Puritan types looking for witches to burn. It's a part of our society.
The American Patriots also did this to Loyalists, but with actual mobs.
Punching back is the appropriate response. Find who these commenters are, find their employer, and then get them fired. The Committee for Civilized Society or what not. No one involved wants to get people fired mind you, but if you try to do that, prepare to taste your own medicine.
Paid comment from the opposition.
You can buy comments you know.
I've never run into these types very often and I've gotten into fights with gays and even THEY were very tolerant and open-minded.
So they are paid comments to encourage other people to act that way.
Also serves to make you men think that it's us women...or like the Puritans.
Denunciations, show trials, reeducation camps. From where and when in history have we knowledge of such things? Answer: every place and every time three or more people who fear and hate individual freedom get together, because they know that individual liberty threatens their hegemonic or dominant social (including religious), economic, or political power.
This is why until 1965 the United States was the best place on God's green earth: there were historically unprecedented long spells of ample employment at good wages, so that anyone who disliked his superior could tell that boss to take this job and shove it, and could then find another job. Since 1965 employment opportunities and wages have both decreased.
Commenter leftist conservative nailed why corporations (and, I would add, the political class, which includes academics and Enemedia-Pravda) use leftist standards of conformism to select and keep cowed their employees. This would not be possible if the U.S. had not passed the Hart-Cellers act and our Dear Rulers did not decline to shut, fortify, and defend our southern border and decline to deport the millions of illegal aliens they've encouraged and allowed to come into our midst. Does anyone believe that it's an accident that the scourge of enforced political correctness and multiculturalism has intensified in direct correlation with the numbers of foreigners admitted to the U.S. since 1965?
Sorry Liz, in point of fact anonymity IS protected by the First Amendment. If you google "supreme court anonymous speech" the very first search result is an EFF page stating: "The Supreme Court has ruled repeatedly that the right to anonymous free speech is protected by the First Amendment." I can do a more in-depth analysis for you, Liz, but I'll need a retainer.
There is an old Twilight Zone episode about this type of person, "Four O'Clock." The protagonist spends his time destroying the lives of people that he sees as evil, only to find out in the end that his actions have made him an evil man.
Off topic but right now Google is featuring a black research chemist on its home page: Percy Lavoin Julian. Oh, Google. You should change your name to Good-le!
"Actually if you want a good example of this personality type check out your fan website "Steve Sailer Sucks"."
I go there sometimes. That place is pathetic in a hilarious way. It's actually the third iteration of said page.
The most depressing thing about the Eich scandal and related happenings is that any opposition will not find political expression. More likely than not is will merely boost support for the Republicans who will then claim it is a mandate to abolish the welfare state should they win election. In terms of this issue things like the Eich firing will only serve to ratchet the existing social system still tighter. The main reason being the lack of an alternative. I cite as evidence of this the fact that all the wretched of the earth can do is make vacuous appeals for freedom. There is no such thing as a free society. Nor has there ever been. Every society has it's mores and its taboos and structures. The real reason white Christian Americans are and should be angry is that theirs has been defeated and is being replaced. Druids probably didn't like being replaced by priests but that's the way it went. Now the priests are being replaced too.
@ H and Orthodox -
No, this is untrue about Puritans. Widely believed but untrue. They were not especial witch-hunters in America, and compared to Western Europe, they were pikers. And Western Europeans were pikers compared to Central and Eastern Europeans in witch-hunts.
The Salem trials were real, but very much an aberration. There were farther-flung incidents much less remembered. Hawthorne and Miller remade history into myths they wanted sold.
As for being anonymous, perhaps the writers weren't thinking of the future employers so much as the unreasonableness of peers like Liz.
Does anyone believe that it's an accident that the scourge of enforced political correctness and multiculturalism has intensified in direct correlation with the numbers of foreigners admitted to the U.S. since 1965?
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Yeah. I do. I also think it's because whites are a tiny portion of world demographic and are now powerless to close "their" borders. You have to stop thinking so small. All of youz on this blog.
Off topic but right now Google is featuring a black research chemist on its home page: Percy Lavoin Julian.
Is he the guy that invented the peanut?
>Remember that some of the earliest Americans were the Puritan types looking for witches to burn. It's a part of our society.<
I must seem like an H.L. Mencken groupie (not guilty, Your Honor) but some topics were so much up his alley and he had such memorable quotes about them that I must post a link to some old article of his, or some old book. If you can wade through the language, this can give you a pretty accurate picture of the American character even today. It bears on the social conformity, the fanaticism, the credulity, and the social-pushing-inspired would-be totalitarianism that prevail in this nation and probably always did. Liz is no new phenomenon.
"Were there always huge numbers of people like this out there before social media came along? " - they probably existed, but back in the days of labor scarcity businesses couldn't afford to indulge in such nonsense.
Oh and, anyone want to point out that the founding fathers used pen names?
Once in a while at gawker/jizzabel they go look for teens or even kids who say things that they deem inappropriate and they out them.
When told that their actions stifle free speech they reply that since the government is not involved there's nothing wrong with what they're doing. I feel that they indulge in persecution partly because they don't fear any repercussions, especially economic ones.
Rightwing people really need to think seriously about separation. Maybe not territorial separation but some kind of milet system needs to arise because it's just not possible to live with the lefties.
"I really think we need some in-depth research into what kind of person wants to ruin the lifelong careers of teenagers by making sure their Permanent Records highlight any and all youthful indiscretions against the current and future rules of political correctness."
Translation:
I want to provide an identifiable target for people in power who are unhappy with the pointed barbs of people with no power.
I'm kind of like the rat-eating hobo who runs errands for the proverbial vampires, because I hope one day, one of the vampires will hold their noses, and make me a vampire too. In the meantime, I am an agent for their bidding during daylight hours.
By providing their names, these kids, while no dire threat, provide a sideshow to other youngsters who are publicly critical to those in power. By my agitating for their names, when I'm successful, the vampires can converge on the kids, a lesson is learned, and I'm that much closer to becoming a registered soul of the damned, Satan willing.
Were there always huge numbers of people like this out there before social media came along
Yes, there were. I have indiscrete quotes from the old altnet bulletin boards from 22 years ago still memorialized by these type of jerks who take great glee in maintaining and expanding their little databases.
I also had the homosexual activists after me the entire time I was in college trying to get me expelled multiple times because I kept saying in public their behavior was disgusting, or because I would prank them online. I recall after one early "indiscretion" where I and some friends vented privately about how "the fags" had ruined something we had done that they found out and went about to everyone liberal I knew on campus and tried to turn me into a pariah among all my new acquaintances for my thoughtcrime of using the word "fag" in a private discussion. It went so far as them having my Physics professor denounce me in freshmen Physics class for my use of the dread word "fag" in a private rant.
I think this is specificially a post Bush 1.0 phenomena of the Clinton era that still lingers with us. These people are truly vicious and hateful and utterly Stalinist.
I've always been told I was not the brightest pencil in the box.
Unbeknownst to me, I was merely a victim of this brand new disease.
anonymous said:
"And I still sing with Dylan as if were saying "split up on the docks that night boh agreeing it was best." Which is better than "split up on a dark, sad night...""
Holy crap. Just looked it up, and you're right! I've been singing the "docks" lyrics for decades!
Nothing is as it seems.
Steve, Volunteer Thought Police is genius. I never thought of it that way before, but now it makes perfect sense. These people are 2 generations, but little else, removed from the women that told us if we drank and smoked we were going to H*ll.
As an aside, there's something very sad about seeing a girl you knew growing up, and thinking "town librarian" for a couple of seconds before recognition sets in. We're all human, and the patterns never really change.
Okay, I read one of their recent issues, and I cannot for the life of me understand the fuss.
Imagine the National Lampoon if it were written by devoted teen potheads from San Diego, pointing to a joke they just came up with on their laptop, and slapping each other five.
It's not that funny, but it's pretty lighthearted, as only kids that age can project. What was entertaining is how hard they try to be funny or obnoxious. These kids aren't inherently dark. They're just goofy. They seem to be having a grand old time, and I have to admit I kind of got caught up in reading their joyful teen rants. Reminded me of when I was their age. Except I was more of a motherfucker, which is why I expected more.
This is a tempest in a teapot, and this magazine is goofy. It's not anywhere near what I was expecting.
The comment about the black teacher is what I'd call a very light cheap shot. Trying to adapt their point of view, they seem to be saying, "you're a cunt in class, and we'd like you to know."
Rather than outing the kid, the better remedy might be for that teacher to avoid being a cunt in class. Without the criticism, she would certainly carry on her alleged cunty ways. With this criticism, it likely will make her more mindful of abject cuntiness. Everybody wins.
If the kids feel the need to indulge in an anonymous satire rag, the administrators should spend more time asking themselves why the kids feel oppressed enough to feel the need to do so-and maybe quit being so county.
"Were there always huge numbers of people like this out there before social media came along?"
It's a natural social cohesion mechanism to enforce social norms. If the people deciding those social norms are mostly benign then the effect is mostly benign. If the ruling class are mostly malign then the effect is malign.
@hacienda
"America seems to undergo a process of continual cultural death. And it's not driven by the top 1%"
It's entirely driven from the top.
Quite obviously.
As a 'conservative leftist' I don't agree this illustrates a particularly left/right dichotomy. In your hypothetical-future Permanent Record, won't the categories of thoughtcrime-etc include (in no particular order, alas, and unpredictably/infinitely elastic):
antisemitism
pro-Islam
sex offenders
racism/sexism/lgbt (esp. speech-crimes)
violence/cruelty (esp. to animals/children/women)
using drugs
taking welfare
voting wrong
joining the wrong clubs
donating to the wrong causes
reading the wrong books/magazines/webpages
watching the wrong porn
sharing the wrong selfies
liberalism/socialism/pro-UN
hypocrisy/attacking hypocrisy
saying-out-loud things that Someone doesn't like said-out-loud
noticing patterns
spelling and grammar errors, typos
correcting spelling and grammar errors and typos...
Internet anonymity is now undependable. Governments and corporations will continue to compile megadata Permanent Records without oversight. We've entered an age where we'll have to start warning our kids that every effing thing they do can come back to haunt them. In the long run maybe this will be purifying...
Disclaimer: I've dated lots of Chicago Lizzes
Remember that some of the earliest Americans were the Puritan types looking for witches to burn. It's a part of our society.
Oh my goodness! Witch burnings! In America! Where could I find a list of these poor burnt witches? Ok, maybe just one. Ok, maybe not even a name. Could you give just the name of a town, village, county or state? A year in which a witch burning occurred? No? How about a century in which a witch was burned? No?
"Well, they're likely female. You yourself said women are less tolerant of dissent."
If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times (and thought it a million).
Women's suffrage and freedom are utterly incompatible.
"I hope you know that this will go down on your permanent record."
"Oh, yeah?!"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__jh3S9DzYU
"I really think we need some in-depth research into what kind of person wants to ruin the lifelong careers of teenagers by making sure their Permanent Records highlight any and all youthful indiscretions against the current and future rules of political correctness."
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Reading Eric Hoffer's classic would be a good start.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_True_Believer
To the extent the Koala writers succeed in later life it WILL come back to haunt them. Loads of people know, and rivals within organisations bring these things up. Koala writers better understand that only if they are failures in later life will they have no regrets.
History shows satire has often proved incredibly counter productive in the political realm.
I suggest disregarding all these dire warnings of what will happen to you if you dare to offend the thought police.
I ignored the thought police my entire life, and I have no regrets.
Most of my life, I worked as a freelance or contract tech guy. Moved from job to job frequently, so nobody ever really caught on to my heretic ideas. And, who really gives a shit what the coder and multimedia guy thinks, anyway?
I worked at a full time job a total of 6 years out of my entire career. Retired a year and a half ago. Hated working for a full time employer. The HR Diversity fags and fag hags were complete assholes. They hated me and I hated them. Good riddance.
Don't take up a career that places you on the ladder of bureaucratic striving for position. Avoid the fight. Find something else to do with your life.
I did, and I'm glad I did. Took a few kicks in the butt, but what the hell... that happens.
Tolerance fanatics are usually crazed with a hatred for those parts of society that don't see things their way. Scratch below the surface and you'll find a huge amount of self-righteousness and intolerance. They're actually the opposite of their public PC persona. These people would join up with any dictatorship as commissars, snitches and neighborhood watch committees. That might seem exaggerated but just look at how many ordinary people came out of nowhere to staff the entire GULAG system, from paper shuffling bureaucrats to rifle-toters, all in the name of achieving utopia. They have a totalitarian mindset; it's just not obvious on the surface.
It all comes down to testosterone. Want to know if you can tell an ethnic joke to your companion? Look at their hands. If their index finger looks shorter than their ring finger feel free to vent about race realism or tell the joke about the rabbi and the porcupine. Otherwise, regard the person with extreme suspicion.
"I suggest disregarding all these dire warnings of what will happen to you if you dare to offend the thought police.
I ignored the thought police my entire life, and I have no regrets.
Most of my life, I worked as a freelance or contract tech guy. Moved from job to job frequently, so nobody ever really caught on to my heretic ideas. And, who really gives a shit what the coder and multimedia guy thinks, anyway?
I worked at a full time job a total of 6 years out of my entire career. Retired a year and a half ago. Hated working for a full time employer. The HR Diversity fags and fag hags were complete assholes. They hated me and I hated them. Good riddance.
Don't take up a career that places you on the ladder of bureaucratic striving for position. Avoid the fight. Find something else to do with your life.
I did, and I'm glad I did. Took a few kicks in the butt, but what the hell... that happens."
This. I'm about 10 years behind you, but same career track. About the only one these days a white gentile male (wgm) can take and keep his self-respect. I decided that 20 years ago. All the wgms on the bottom in corporations are seething with resentment and the ones at the top are treasonous sellouts who will eventually spend eternity in a burning pot of feces or whatever it is that YKW says is happening to Jesus.
Where could I find a list of these poor burnt witches?
Uh, Google. Try "Salem Witch Trials"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_of_the_Salem_witch_trials#Found_or_pled_guilty
Convicted and executed
Bridget Bishop (executed June 10, 1692)
Rebecca Nurse (née Towne) (July 19, 1692)
Sarah Good (formerly Sarah Poole, née Solart) (July 19, 1692)
Elizabeth Howe (née Jackson) (July 19, 1692) – wife of Thomas Howe
Susannah Martin (née North) (July 19, 1692)
George Burroughs (August 19, 1692)
George Jacobs, Sr. (August 19, 1692)
John Proctor (August 19, 1692) – husband of Elizabeth Proctor
John Willard (August 19, 1692)
Martha Corey (September 22, 1692) – wife of Giles Corey
Mary Eastey (née Towne) (September 22, 1692)
Mary Parker (née Ayer) (September 22, 1692)
Ann Pudeator (September 22, 1692)
Wilmot Redd (September 22, 1692)
Samuel Wardwell, Sr. (September 22, 1692)
PS You're an idiot.
"Were there always huge numbers of people like this out there before social media came along?"
I suspect so.
People like Liz would have been informants for the Gestapo, Stasi, NKVD, etc.
People who are naturally inclined to be bullies are attracted to any outlet that allows them to engage in what would otherwise be totally unacceptable behavior. The tenets of political correctness are sacrosanct, and aggression against those who violate PC is not just tolerated, it's encouraged. The left offers plenty of opportunities for such people to indulge their impulses. For the bullies, it's a win-win situation; they get to push people around, and not only do they go unsanctioned for their antics, they're rewarded for them. Remember that when you see the next episode of Real Time.
For this reason alone, opponents of PC dogma ought to realize that trying to appease the left or ingratiate themselves to liberals is never going to work. Ditto for trying to reason with them. Liberals don't win hearts and minds; they use force to get what they want. The only way to deal with them is to either acquiesce or start speaking to them in their own language. Perhaps more of them should be hounded from their jobs and shunned by the people in their lives.
Once in a while at Gawker/jizzabel they go look for teens or even kids who say things that they deem inappropriate and they out them.
When told that their actions stifle free speech they reply that since the government is not involved there's nothing wrong with what they're doing. I feel that they indulge in persecution partly because they don't fear any repercussions, especially economic ones.
Of course; they're bullies. The Left seeks and offers freedom for aggression. Their minions have a license to hurt people, and misanthropes like Liz take advantage.
The Salem trials were real, but very much an aberration.
Yes, and the witches were hanged, not burned.
It's entirely driven from the top.
Quite obviously.
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The big changes in culture have occurred not only in the US, but worldwide.
Among these things- women's economic independence in large and visible numbers (a new thing). End of communism as a rival ideology. Demographic decline of West in relative and even absolute numbers. The evisceration of Catholicism, Islamic fundamentalism. Rise of Asia (all parts). Rise of global communications.
None of these things are top driven, not even the technological developments which are created by really clever people, but not really controlled by them. Too much churn.
"Don't take up a career that places you on the ladder of bureaucratic striving for position. Avoid the fight. Find something else to do with your life."
Shouting Thomas:
The economy sucks, and it's harder to get by doing that these days.
I'm not a lawyer but...
the Constitutional position is tricky. The Supreme Court has ruled that the First Amendment provides a right to anonymous free speech, but that is not the same as a Constitutional right to anonymity. For example, it would be unconstitutional for a State legislature to ban certain forms of writing unless the writers disclosed their true identity, but it would not, as far as I can see, be unconstitutional or unlawful to disclose their identity if discovered by some other means.
"Off topic but right now Google is featuring a black research chemist on its home page: Percy Lavoin Julian.
Is he the guy that invented the peanut?"
That's so good.
Finally someone as funny as me on this site.
Dan in DC
Punching back is the appropriate response. Find who these commenters are, find their employer, and then get them fired.
The problem is the left has the whip hand. People get fired all the time for holding non-pc beliefs, but on what basis are you going to get someone fired for their left-wing views? Those are officially approved. Van Jones may have lost his White House position for being an actual card-carrying Communist, which was a little too blatant for the administration, but he made a soft landing at CNN and a couple of Soros-funded sinecures. Doesn't work that way for those on the right.
If you're brave enough to be a "tireless warrior against political correctness" or whatever, you should be brave enough to start your own business.
Why shouldn't those spineless kids (who know the kind of ruckus they are intentionally seeking to provoke) face consequences for their actions? Real pussy opinion Steve.
Now you can see why ghetto blacks hate snitches.
The fact that the writers of the Koala will not print their own names on the byline suggests that all involved with the publication realize that the articles are sufficiently offensive that they might negatively affect future job prospects. If people wish to limit the scope of the Koala a simple strategy would be to provide the social feedback that the writers fear: set up a webpage linking their names to the articles. Free speech is protected by the Constitution, as it should be. Anonymity is not.
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The fact that the dissidents of the Soviet Union will not announce their own names to the public suggests that all involved with the opposition realize that their beliefs are sufficiently offensive that they might negatively affect future survival prospects. If people wish to limit the scope of the dissident movement a simple strategy would be to provide the social feedback that the dissidents fear: print publications linking them to the dissident movement. Free speech is a good thing, but anonymity is not.
~~~
The fact that the Jews of Hitler's Germany would not announce their own Jewishness to the public suggests that all involved with Judaism realize their Jewishness is sufficiently offensive that they might negatively affect future survival prospects. If people wish to limit the scope of Jewishness a simple strategy would be to provide the social feedback that the Jews fear: print publications linking them to Judaism. Freedom of religion is a human right, but anonymity is not.
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The fact that the homosexuals of the Muslim world will not announce their homosexuality to the public suggests that they realize that their homosexuality is sufficiently offensive that it might negatively affect future survival prospects. If people wish to limit the scope of homosexuality a simple strategy would be to provide the social feedback that homosexuals fear: set up a webpage linking them to homosexuality. What they do in their bedrooms is a human right, but anonymity is not.
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The fact that minority opinions are often expressed anonymously suggests that they realize that their beliefs may offend the majority, or powerful interests, and thus might negatively affect their future prospects. If people wish to limit the scope of minority opinions a simple strategy would be to provide the social feedback that the minority fears: set up a webpage linking their names to the minority opinions. Free speech is protected by the Constitution, as it should be. Anonymity is not. And it's much easier to harass, intimidate, punish, harm, imprison, or kill people when their identities are known.
"leftist conservative said...
Same as it ever was. The more things change, the more they stay the same.
Commie-hunters, brownshirts, witch hunters, anti-racist, all same-same."
Yours is a superficial and juvenile interperetation of events. Americans tend to be insular and lack understanding of the wider world, and often even their own country and the forces that shaped it.
Slogan for us.
Amnesty is election fraud on a massive scale.
20 million illegal voters added to the ballot.
Steve, this story deserves your attention. It's simply mind boggling. A 3rd generation Black IU student loses out on a $1 million because he can't pronounce "Achilles". He also loses another puzzle because he thinks a car is person.
http://ethicsalarms.com/2014/04/12/the-strange-sad-ominous-case-of-college-student-julian-batts-and-his-wheel-of-fortune-disaster/
"Anonymous said...
Off topic but right now Google is featuring a black research chemist on its home page: Percy Lavoin Julian. Oh, Google. You should change your name to Good-le!"
Yeah, but the guy seems to have been a genuinely productive research chemist. Nothing wrong with drawing people's attention to such men and their accomplishments. Although (and this may have been your point) Google would never bother to highlight the career of a white person of similar attainment.
"The Clash's 1979 song "Clampdown" gives us a pretty persuasive picture of the kind of guy who would bully political dissidents for a paycheck, a cool uniform, and the enjoyment of humiliating somebody face to face"
Sounds like the Clash itself. They supported Marxist regimes that denied freedom to dissidents, and I'll bet its surviving members all hate conservatives, are for open immigration, and support PC rules against 'hate speech'.
Liz is incorrect. The Supreme Court has ruled multiple times protecting anonymous/pseudonymous speech. Most recently in 1995 McIntyre vs. Ohio Elections Commiesion. The ruling cited the very idea these progressive activists want to use "retaliation".
Everything that happens in America is cynically steered from the top. Democracy is the mask of plutocracy.
"Truth said...
If you're brave enough to be a "tireless warrior against political correctness" or whatever, you should be brave enough to start your own business."
And if you do, ask "Truth" about opportunities in the lucrative water-powered-car business. He can give you advice.
NYT:
One shouted back, “I’m black” and called the tabloid racist.
Ironical.
I ran across a 1920's "Johnson Smith" novelty catalog, which had a couple of pages of ethnic joke books - Jews, blacks, Scots, Irish, Italians ....
X million-dollar lottery: You win a dollar a year for a million years.
I wonder what the reaction would be - from the People Who Matter - if this were published today:
http://lampoon.rwinters.com/NL052-July1974.jpg
(Nat. Lampoon, July 1974)
Maybe she is one of the teachers sacked in the latest sacrifice to the god of disparate impact.
"Stasi-informer" is for sure a personality type, but I think actually you guys have "Liz" wrong. You have to keep in mind that she's *commenting on the Internet*. What she's indulging in is--a feeling with which we're all familiar--costless self-righteousness. There's a certain frisson that accompanies declaring yourself for the Right Team; and, in a comments section, the tendency is to push the rhetoric all the way. --After all, it's not as though she's actually going to have to follow through.
"Remember that some of the earliest Americans were the Puritan types looking for witches to burn. It's a part of our society.
Or, it's a bunch of pod people."
One more time. The "Puritans" (nickname for those separating from the Church of England, for plainer territories) did not "burn" anybody, witches or goblins or atheists. All the executed were hanged, or in one case, crushed by heavy weights and that may have been an accident.
Burning alive was not prescribed for witchcraft in English law. You're confusing the English with Continental Europeans, who did it fairly often, especially in German speaking countries.
No, the only crimes for which one could be burned alive were treason and heresy. A woman could be burned alive for killing her husband because it was considered treason.
The English convicted very few witches and compared to other countries, performed very little and but light torture. Keeping a person awake for 48 hrs (frequent ploy in the 17th c. to get info) is very annoying and effective, but can't be compared to tearing flesh with hot irons (Germany again), or sawing in half vertically (French favorite).
The Puritans split a few noses, but that was for crimes other than witchcraft and they gave it up pretty early. Just too nasty.
In fact, by the second half of the 1700s, public and hangings and the rare burning were causing a lot of bad PR on the Village Green as residents complained about the mess and turmoil they caused.
In the end, the English preferred a well kept village green to the blood and ashes of the damned littering their walkways.
The American "Puritans" were not too different.
McIntyre v. Ohio Elections Commission actually says that anonymity in speech is protected under the 1st Amendment.
"Liz is incorrect. The Supreme Court has ruled multiple times protecting anonymous/pseudonymous speech. Most recently in 1995 McIntyre vs. Ohio Elections Commiesion. The ruling cited the very idea these progressive activists want to use "retaliation"."
Anonymous speech is protected against government interference, but the commentator is right, there is no constitutional right to prevent others from revealing your anonymity.
According to Wikipedia, "McIntyre v. Ohio Elections Commission, 514 U.S. 334 (1995), is a United States Supreme Court case in which the Court held that an Ohio statute that prohibits anonymous political or campaign literature is unconstitutional." Once again, this has nothing to do with what Liz was calling for, which is private citizens setting up websites in order to identify those who make politically incorrect remarks.
Sitting in a SF hospital lobby. Young dad is joking with 2 year-old son, "chocolate scones! That's a lot of chocolate, huh?" Wife says, "could you try to establish good eating habits please?"
They're pod people, they're everywhere.
They are not being paid; they are on a religious crusade. They are religious zealots; they just don't know it.
Secular progressivism is the religion of a certain type of people who don't have a real religion and use it for a substitute.
They are perfectly capable of conducting real life pogroms and witch-burnings. One of the "progressive" commenters I saw on a blog about Eich actually said, "We've got to stamp out evil wherever we see it." The same person would probably screech like a banshee if Pat Robertson made the same comment about abortion of school prayer.
Yes, they are Cotton Mather's spiritual heirs.
An early commenter wrote: "Some Clash stuff: Terry Chimes was-is an admirer of the late Maggie Thatcher. Chimes was politically the polar opposite of Joe Strummer. Terry Chimes was bona fide working class as opposed to Strummer's upper class background. Strummer was very upset when Chimes quit the Clash. These days, Terry Chimes is the number one Chiropractor in England....... Bill Blizzard and his Men....."
Terry Chimes was credited on the first Clash album as Tory Crimes.
"Off topic but right now Google is featuring a black research chemist on its home page: Percy Lavoin Julian.
Is he the guy that invented the peanut?"
The inventor of "penaut butter" was George Washington Carver, who was rescued as an infant (abandoned I think), and raised by a white couple.
Carver actually did more productive things than peanut butter which would have been discovered anyway, with the advent of a electric blenders. But if he were white, he probably would not be conisdered a major scientist or inventor, just a very good one.
"Where could I find a list of these poor burnt witches?
Uh, Google. Try "Salem Witch Trials""
They weren't burned. They were hanged. Big difference, especially if you were the one being burned/hanged.
Scene from the Six Wives of Henry VIII, when Henry told Anne she would not die by the ax. For a moment she thought he meant she'd be burned and she was very upset...but, no, he assured her. The best swordsman in France was to be brought over to do the job. She was quite relieved.
Whites + Asians = Eloi.
As long as they don't literally burn their victims, everything is cool and the Puritans are admirable. Oh, sweet jasper..
We need a Voltaire. "Crush the infamy."
The only thing that keeps me going is my firm belief that the current PC/leftoid regime is merely a temporary (like A-CHILL-us) aberration, and that sanity will prevail. I just hope I live to see it.
Anonydroid at 10:31 AM said: Sounds like the Clash itself. They supported Marxist regimes that denied freedom to dissidents, and I'll bet its surviving members all hate conservatives, are for open immigration, and support PC rules against 'hate speech'.
Hunsdon said: yeah, but in their defence: "The only band that matters." Plus the guitar intro from "Should I stay or should I go" is in my all time top ten.
No offense to Mr. Chimes/Crimes but Topper totally killed on that track
From wikipedia entry on Sadistic Personality Disorder...
Enforcing sadist (compulsive features)[edit]
Enforcing sadists can be found among military sergeants, deans of universities, prison overseers, police officers or other authoritative functions because they are in a position where they feel they should be the ones controlling and punishing people who have broken rules, regulations, or laws.[12] Though they believe themselves to act in the common interest, they have deeper motives: these sadists generally seek rule-breakers in their domain of authority--or in society in general--and exercise the most severe punishments. Enforcing sadists who are police or prison staff are rarely perceived to be unjust and therefore have great freedom to dominate, victimize, or destroy others at will. Their personalities cannot appropriately respond to the emotions that drive their sadistically vicious behaviors.[12] As these sadists dominate and punish others, so increases satisfaction and power they feel, reinforcing their self-perception of righteousness and increasing their ego. This intoxication can unleash their behavior and blind them to reality, usually without attracting any negative attention because they act within their legal authority to exert power and normally behave in everyday situations.
The internet allows this more.
You're only allowed to say outrageous things about sex or religion these days.
The Liz types have always existed, but can now publish their venom anonymously (without the cooperation of, say, a deadtree newspaper "Letters to the Editor" supervisor, who would insist on publishing the name and city of the author, and might not find Liz's dumbassery suitable for publication (Online publications are not so selective...space is cheap). Another way that Liz might have made this statement in the past would have been at a public meeting of, say, a civic organization or political group...the downside to making a statement in the presence of a group of people would include the possibility of immediate, unfavorable feedback from someone present, e.g. "Sod off, Liz", thus motivating Liz to be more discreet in her statements. The Internet allows one to publish one's thoughts, immediatly and without filters. Not always a good thing.
One of the accused in Salem, Giles Corey, refused to plead, and was pressed to death, which was essentially piling weights on top of you until you confessed or died.
When I read about the neo-Puritans of the Left, I always think of Mel Brooks and Blazing Saddles, a movie that could never be made today. It's never shown anymore in its uncut version.
Censorship in postwar Germany:
...As far as I know, the famous book burning occurred as a symbolic act in several places in Germany, and yet all the books thrown into the fire in this symbolic act of rejection of the destructive ideas given coinage by being printed and sold in book form, afterwards were still on the shelves and available in bookstores.
Compare that with today’s censorship in the Federal Republic of Germany where books with undesirable tendencies are ordered to be withdrawn from sale, production and advertising, and existing stocks are ordered to be incinerated; publishers and authors are fined or imprisoned for undesirable statements. In addition, in 1945, about 40000 titles were on Allied Control Council orders to be destroyed completely, and that was probably successful with quite a few, even if many of these titles were hidden away during the difficult years in private quarters. In the 1950s there were Jewish agents travelling through German lands, buying up books from private libraries, sending them back to Israel for incineration – everything paid for by German tax payers. This is according to Roland Bohlinger who reprinted in his Freie Republik Uhlenhof many such books. I am not an expert in the law contortions necessary to maintain the principle of prohibition of censorship while at the same time exercising it, so I cannot explain how this worked; but Roland Bohlinger was many times in court and lost a lot of money to fines for having his own opinion in a public manner. Try to check out Mein Kampf or Der Mythus des 20. Jahrhunderts in a public library and you might be led to the poison cabinet with the forbidden books, if they even have these books.
"Why shouldn't those spineless kids (who know the kind of ruckus they are intentionally seeking to provoke) face consequences for their actions? Real pussy opinion Steve."
Says he while commenting anonymously.
Terry Chimes didn't drum on "Clampdown," Topper Headon did. Not sure why Terry is even being referenced.
- DOBA
"It would be a pretty easy experiment for psych professors to survey students to see who thinks it's a great idea to join the Volunteer Auxiliary Thought Police. What are their demographics? Why are they so hate-filled toward people who get more fun out of life?"
I agree with the commenters above that is the old fashioned Puritianism that has run all through American history. Once it was sex or alcohol, now it is political correctness. H.L. Mencken — "There is only one honest impulse at the bottom of Puritanism, and that is the impulse to punish the man with a superior capacity for happiness."
I agree with the commenters above that is the old fashioned Puritianism that has run all through American history. Once it was sex or alcohol, now it is political correctness.
No, this scapegoating of Puritans won't cut it. The Puritans never had "puritanical" attitudes toward sex or alcohol. Even Whiskey has read Albion's Seed -- what are the rest of you waiting for?
Burning alive was not prescribed for witchcraft in English law. You're confusing the English with Continental Europeans, who did it fairly often, especially in German speaking countries.
No, the only crimes for which one could be burned alive were treason and heresy. A woman could be burned alive for killing her husband because it was considered treason.
Dan "The Pope is a Protestant" Browne made this mistake in the best seller The Da Vinci Code so you can see where people get this erroneous information.
The inventor of "penaut butter" was George Washington Carver
Wow! He is almost as talented as Steve Jobs who invented the personal computer, the mouse, the Graphics User Interface, the iPod, the iPhone and, most importantly of all, rounded corners.
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